Thoughts on next Gen Console Specs?

[BabyTyrant]

It really seems like they are making the effort to decrease the gap between Consoles and PCs

Yes I know PCs are still the superior platform spec wise, and always will be; especially towards the higher end when you start getting above the price that consoles release at, if they released consoles at $800 or up nobody would buy them at all

Sony had a hard enough time selling PS3s at first when they released at a $600 price tag (mind you that's because of Blu-Ray technology being brand new at the time)

I'm rather impressed with what they are achieving at what will probably be a price of somewhere around $400-$500 (Xbox announced a $500 price tag AFAIK, Sony hasnt released Price yet)

Basically Xbox Series X will be the more powerful on paper; but PS5 seems like it will be optimized to run better on slightly lower specs; so PS5 will actually end up running better

But regardless the performance gap going from current to next gen Will be amazing

And as long as people are gonna be unwilling to spend a high cost and there are exclusive games on Consoles, there will be a market for them

The exclusives games are really worth having a console, at least with PlayStation consoles

Watch everyone realize it when Timed Exclusives run out and start releasing on PC and everyone who skipped a game due to exclusivity is like "wow this is so amazing, I wish I could have played it sooner"

 

[Midwest82]

Im alright with boost in performance. Along with that ia gonna come a price tag.

I have a higher end gaming pc and an xbox one. There is a huge diference in response, load times, and visuals when im playing something cross platform like SOT on my pc vs my xbox. It is still fun on both, but my pc wins hands down.

And hopefully the push in technology will bring better, more capable games to the platforms as well. The current generation of platforms out ran the technology long ago so I'm okay with it.

 

[PlinkinginPink]

After the 360 I am done with consoles and won't be wasting money on them any more.
I had an Xbox 1 ended up giving it away I disliked it so much.
Regardless of price tag consoles just don't seem worth it any more.
I'll stick to my PC.

 

[BabyTyrant]

After the 360 I am done with consoles and won't be wasting money on them any more.
I had an Xbox 1 ended up giving it away I disliked it so much.
Regardless of price tag consoles just don't seem worth it any more.
I'll stick to my PC.

Fair enough, not everyone has the same wants and needs

But TBH, I think Xbone was a disappointment to a lot of people, it was underpowered even compared to the PS4 (PS4 ran better and had full 1080P graphics, whereas Xbone capped off at 900P)

Then there was the Mid-Generation updates in the Xbone X and PS4 Pro (significantly more power and 4K Graphics, even if PS4 Pro is upscaled they do it so good that it's just as good as Xbone X in many cases)

Next Gen is gonna start out at roughly 2-3 times as strong as current Gen consoles, with SSDs instead of Hard Drives (Finally), doubling the RAM from the current 8GB of DDR5 to 16GB of DDR6

and overhauled Audio along with Ray Tracing Capabilities for more realistic textures and supposedly the rumble feature on the PS5 Controllers is getting refined as well to be more customized to match individual sensations; rather than the only thing they control being vibration Intensity

And they may be refining the triggers on the PS5 Controllers as well

With consoles they will at times sell at a minimal profit, or even take a loss because they can make it up in game sales

The bigger the immediate install base of users, the more games they can sell; so if they lose some money at 1st it wouldnt take them long to make it up when they start selling significantly more games than they would have if fewer people buy the consoles

 

[Fangs]

I hear ps5 won't have disks it'll be all digital download

 

[BabyTyrant]

I hear ps5 won't have disks it'll be all digital download

Theres been so much Speculation on all kinds of baseless BullShit lately, and that's just another case of it

IF there was a Disc-less version it would be one thing; but they aren't going to kill off the Disc Drive

If anything that's something Xbox would do (they already have an All Digital Xbone out, and they are supposed to go to Cloud Gaming anyways) like how they thought they could kill functionality of using old game Discs on the Xbone and force everyone to have to buy brand nee games every single time

That and the Xbone being Weaker and costing $100 more at launch enabled Sony to "Win" the PS4 vs Xbone Generation very easily

 

[12srepaid]

I'm fine withe the Xbox One now, but like many, I wasn't thrilled about it's restrictions. such things as requiring Kinect, or DRM restrictions. A console can have the best specs, but if it ditches versatile functionality, it's worthless to me.
I would not get a console without a disc player, as I very rarely buy digital games.

 

[BabyTyrant]

I'm fine withe the Xbox One now, but like many, I wasn't thrilled about it's restrictions. such things as requiring Kinect, or DRM restrictions. A console can have the best specs, but if it ditches versatile functionality, it's worthless to me.
I would not get a console without a disc player, as I very rarely buy digital games.

Me either, but the only Console I'm aware of that doesn't have a disc drive is that one version of the Xbone S they made to sell cheaper than the normal One S

That and Google Stadia I guess since it's for cloud gaming? (I haven't read up on it)

Theres been tons of speculation about the next gen consoles, so I wouldn't believe anything unless it's from the brands themselves

We do know the technical Data as they have stated that much and on that front people are gonna think the Xbox Series X is gonna be the more powerful console

But it sounds like PS5 is going for Efficiency, so their "Lower" numbers should actually end up performing the same or better and they are focusing on so much more than Raw Tflops and amount of Computing Units

Which goes back to Effeciency because parts that have to Multi-task and do more than the main thing they are supposed to do, will reroute some of that "Raw Power" to those other tasks

12 Tflops isnt really higher than 10.5 if 20% of the 12 has to be used on sound while the 10.5 can be used just on processing power to keep the performance running as good as it needs to be (while running at lower speeds when its unnecessary)

IMO Xboxs approach is the "Idiot Approach"

They know people are gonna see "12 > 10.5" and those obsessed with having "The Most Powerful Console" (like the One X) will probably be buying Xbox

But power means Diddly Squat if it's not gonna have any good games you wanna play and I have been disappointed with Xbox Exclusives for a long time (whereas Sony exclusives are quality exclusives that usually get high scores across the board)

And honestly both are gonna be so much stronger than what is currently available, the only thing that can compete power wise is gonna be a decent PC

 

[RubberJin]

It's a long time since I've cared about a console, as the specs have gotten better the games have gotten more samey, and this whole "online subscription" / paid DLC stuff just leaves me cold.

Last console I bought was PS2 for GT and GTA but those got kinda dull. The Wii is fun but that's mostly because of the retro SNES/NES games available on it.

 

[BabyTyrant]

It's a long time since I've cared about a console, as the specs have gotten better the games have gotten more samey, and this whole "online subscription" / paid DLC stuff just leaves me cold.

Last console I bought was PS2 for GT and GTA but those got kinda dull. The Wii is fun but that's mostly because of the retro SNES/NES games available on it.

Theres a lot of Retro Style and old school games you wouldn't need a subscription for at all if that's your kind of thing

While it may seem like $60 per year is a lot to pay for online; there are ways to get deals several times a year and the more expensive subscriptions (Sony and Xbox) give you Free Games every month

Even if you say "that's not free"; at most its $5 a month, and usually you get several times that in game value on an average month

Nintendo Switch Online is only $20 per year (it's more basic though and doesnt have free games every month)

If there were no free games, I wouldn't be so willing to pay the subscription fee every year for online; but I can usually count on getting 3 or 4 good games I actually like and wanted to play in the year and that plus the features are worth the price tag

As far as "Games getting more Samey"

I agree when it comes to certain Franchises that seem to have Blind Drones/Sheep for fans that will buy a minimally changed game every year (CoD, Sports Games, etc)

I have been pleasantly surprised this Generation by the newest God of War, Horizon Zero Dawn, Nier Automata and many others

 

[Cottontail]

TBH I haven't been paying too much attention to the compute specs. The numbers always go up and the new games generally follow along. Upgrades are inevitable. Mostly I'll be looking forward to backward compatibility. I feel like we're (hopefully) getting to the point where some level of backward compatibility will just be the norm. Sony did that for a while, stopped, and now seems to be picking it back up again, which I'm grateful for. I frequently go back and replay old games, and I'm dead sick of having to have umpteen consoles connected to my TV.

 

[BabyTyrant]

TBH I haven't been paying too much attention to the compute specs. The numbers always go up and the new games generally follow along. Upgrades are inevitable. Mostly I'll be looking forward to backward compatibility. I feel like we're (hopefully) getting to the point where some level of backward compatibility will just be the norm. Sony did that for a while, stopped, and now seems to be picking it back up again, which I'm grateful for. I frequently go back and replay old games, and I'm dead sick of having to have umpteen consoles connected to my TV.

So far they have stated there is going to be PS4 support both in regular mode and a "Pro" mode for games that were made to make use of the Pros extra power

It kinda seems like they might extend it further to the PS3, 2, and 1

But that hasnt been confirmed and people seem convinced that 3 might not happen at all because it may be the trickier one to nail down with the least selling power added if Sony did nail it

As for Performance, you can think of it as the PS5 and Next Xbox finally getting to Specs of that of a decent PC, with PS5 going with a more customized approach that takes A LOT more into account than just "heres 12 Tflops and 60 Compute units" or whatever the CU number is

Basically PS5 sounds like it will be made for efficiency, so 10.5 Tflops used efficiently will be the same or more in the real world as the Xboxs 12

 

[Cottontail]

It kinda seems like they might extend it further to the PS3, 2, and 1

If only, but I can't see them going back beyond the PS4. Besides the wildly different architectures, you also have to consider the costs involved with testing that backward compatibility and then supporting it. A lot of these things are much less testable and supportable than they are doable from a technical standpoint, which is why they're ultimately not done.

As for Performance, you can think of it as the PS5 and Next Xbox finally getting to Specs of that of a decent PC, with PS5 going with a more customized approach that takes A LOT more into account than just "heres 12 Tflops and 60 Compute units" or whatever the CU number is

Basically PS5 sounds like it will be made for efficiency, so 10.5 Tflops used efficiently will be the same or more in the real world as the Xboxs 12

Comparing PCs and consoles will always be tricky. It's tempting to just line up the numbers (the marketing departments obviously want you to!), but a console's operating system is almost always going to be simpler and more game-optimized, with a lean-and-mean set of drivers and a minimum of legacy cruft. Developers of console-targeted games can also write more efficient code, because they don't have to anticipate and code for a gazillion different possible hardware configurations. There's just one (or sometimes two, like for these "pro" consoles, which is why I dislike them), so the code is tidier and the testers also have an easier job testing the core functionality of the game rather than juggling an infinite expanse of hardware configurations and trying to make sure the graphics and framerate and all are acceptable. Developing games for PC is an absolute nightmare that definitely translates to quality issues, even with the fancy game engines we have these days.

Of course, many games target both.

 

[BabyTyrant]

If only, but I can't see them going back beyond the PS4. Besides the wildly different architectures, you also have to consider the costs involved with testing that backward compatibility and then supporting it. A lot of these things are much less testable and supportable than they are doable from a technical standpoint, which is why they're ultimately not done.


Comparing PCs and consoles will always be tricky. It's tempting to just line up the numbers (the marketing departments obviously want you to!), but a console's operating system is almost always going to be simpler and more game-optimized, with a lean-and-mean set of drivers and a minimum of legacy cruft. Developers of console-targeted games can also write more efficient code, because they don't have to anticipate and code for a gazillion different possible hardware configurations. There's just one (or sometimes two, like for these "pro" consoles, which is why I dislike them), so the code is tidier and the testers also have an easier job testing the core functionality of the game rather than juggling an infinite expanse of hardware configurations and trying to make sure the graphics and framerate and all are acceptable. Developing games for PC is an absolute nightmare that definitely translates to quality issues, even with the fancy game engines we have these days.

Of course, many games target both.

They made the Pro and One X because of 4K coming along and it seeing a more than fair amount of success, plus Base PS4 and Xbone are pretty weak and the Pro and One X were a sizable Power increase over the Base Versions

When the PS5 and Series X debut they will basically start out at twice the power of the Pro and One X, which along with the SSDs will mean load times that almost 100% disappear and systems that run better and smoother than ever before

With some games seemingly pushing the power of current gen to their limits, the SSDs and increased power will take playing current Gen games to new heights and it will be great seeing what new Multi-platform and exclusive games come out as well.

 

[Cottontail]

They made the Pro and One X because of 4K coming along and it seeing a more than fair amount of success, plus Base PS4 and Xbone are pretty weak and the Pro and One X were a sizable Power increase over the Base Versions

Oh yeah, I totally get why they went "Pro." I'm just saying that it sucks for the non-Pro users. Suddenly it doesn't (seem to) matter if playback on the non-Pro machine drops frames like crazy, for example. Seems like that's most titles anymore. :-/

But yeah, systems gotta get better. Assuming the PS5 ships with PS4 compat, I'll be glad I didn't buy a PS4 Pro.

 

[BabyTyrant]

Oh yeah, I totally get why they went "Pro." I'm just saying that it sucks for the non-Pro users. Suddenly it doesn't (seem to) matter if playback on the non-Pro machine drops frames like crazy, for example. Seems like that's most titles anymore. :-/

But yeah, systems gotta get better. Assuming the PS5 ships with PS4 compat, I'll be glad I didn't buy a PS4 Pro.

I actually feel like it's the opposite, there are still a lot of Base PS4 and Xbones out there

So Developers are tasked with trying to make their games run good on the better version, as well as the cheaper/worse version

This is even worse for Multi-Platform developers as they would end up trying to optimize games for Xbone, S, X, PS4, and PS4 Pro, so the games may actually be held back to not overload the base versions of the systems

Which means they may not reach their true potential unless they simultaneously work on a specific 4K HDR mode for the higher spec consoles as well

And I think PS4 Support will be a given on day 1 with at least 100 games optimized to run in a boosted "Pro" Mode

 

[Cottontail]

So Developers are tasked with trying to make their games run good on the better version, as well as the cheaper/worse version

This is even worse for Multi-Platform developers as they would end up trying to optimize games for Xbone, S, X, PS4, and PS4 Pro, so the games may actually be held back to not overload the base versions of the systems

Which means they may not reach their true potential unless they simultaneously work on a specific 4K HDR mode for the higher spec consoles as well

I imagine both pro and non-pro considerations pollute the development processes in equal measure, but the number of reviews that talk about dropped frames on the non-pro is pretty...a lot. That includes all my favorite RPG titles, from Ni No Kuni II (the reason I bought my PS4 a couple of years ago) to the latest Final Fantasy VII Remake Demo. Although, in fairness to Level 5, they patched Ni No Kuni a few days after release to help with the horrible framerate on the non-pro (although it's still jerky in the overworld), and Square has clearly worked hard to make the game not suck on the non-pro, though the framerate clearly dips on wide shots, shadows move in slow motion, and certain lighting effects are just omitted.

Pretty sure that if the pro didn't exist, neither would those issues. Instead, we've got the console analog of the eternal gaming PC dilemma: To upgrade, or not to upgrade?

I wonder when (if) we'll see console development really stall--like for most of 10 years. Games need more resources than the average PC app, but then regular apps used to drive upgrades in the PC world. Look at it now, though: A ten-year-old PC can still run productivity software like a champ. Unless you're a gamer, those upgrades can be few and far between.

4K is one driver for game machine upgrades, but it's been painfully slow to take hold. When this next generation of consoles lands, it seems to me that the capabilities will, maybe for the first time ever, be beyond the average TV gamer to appreciate. I know I certainly won't be buying a 4K TV anytime soon. Available wall space + distance from couch = no point. I've got a few gamer friends with PS4's, but my only friend with a 4K TV doesn't play games on it. He just watches football.

Nintendo's blossoming strategy of "fuck the TV" is looking like a winner long-term. If Sony and Microsoft exchange too many nukes in this war for TV supremacy, they might end up too far ahead of the curve to have any real practical advantage over one another. TBH, I think they've both already run off ahead of the average user.

The marketing departments will of course try like hell to sell you on the numbers. They'll have to. Because it'll probably be hard as hell to see much of a difference between a PS4 Pro and a PS5 on a 1080p screen--which is what most people still have.

 

[BabyTyrant]

I imagine both pro and non-pro considerations pollute the development processes in equal measure, but the number of reviews that talk about dropped frames on the non-pro is pretty...a lot. That includes all my favorite RPG titles, from Ni No Kuni II (the reason I bought my PS4 a couple of years ago) to the latest Final Fantasy VII Remake Demo. Although, in fairness to Level 5, they patched Ni No Kuni a few days after release to help with the horrible framerate on the non-pro (although it's still jerky in the overworld), and Square has clearly worked hard to make the game not suck on the non-pro, though the framerate clearly dips on wide shots, shadows move in slow motion, and certain lighting effects are just omitted.

Pretty sure that if the pro didn't exist, neither would those issues. Instead, we've got the console analog of the eternal gaming PC dilemma: To upgrade, or not to upgrade?

I wonder when (if) we'll see console development really stall--like for most of 10 years. Games need more resources than the average PC app, but then regular apps used to drive upgrades in the PC world. Look at it now, though: A ten-year-old PC can still run productivity software like a champ. Unless you're a gamer, those upgrades can be few and far between.

4K is one driver for game machine upgrades, but it's been painfully slow to take hold. When this next generation of consoles lands, it seems to me that the capabilities will, maybe for the first time ever, be beyond the average TV gamer to appreciate. I know I certainly won't be buying a 4K TV anytime soon. Available wall space + distance from couch = no point. I've got a few gamer friends with PS4's, but my only friend with a 4K TV doesn't play games on it. He just watches football.

Nintendo's blossoming strategy of "fuck the TV" is looking like a winner long-term. If Sony and Microsoft exchange too many nukes in this war for TV supremacy, they might end up too far ahead of the curve to have any real practical advantage over one another. TBH, I think they've both already run off ahead of the average user.

The marketing departments will of course try like hell to sell you on the numbers. They'll have to. Because it'll probably be hard as hell to see much of a difference between a PS4 Pro and a PS5 on a 1080p screen--which is what most people still have.

I've been pretty impressed with what the PS4 Pro can do, it upscales games rather beautifully to look absolutely stunning when those games are made properly to take advantage of the Upscaling; its noticeably quite a bit better than 1080P

I dont even care that the One X is "Native" 4K, vs maybe 95% of that on a well made, optimized game for PS4 Pro

Next generation will see a huge jump in Raw Power, Resolution (4K Native to start with, and supposedly compatibility with 8K) and a more stable frame rate at a better resolution

Its getting to the point that 4K TVs are actually quite affordable, your Base 4K TVs are gonna be what used to be considered Mid-Range

Mid Range will be much more like Top of the Line

And the Top of the Line models will end up being better than anything before it

Its natural as time goes on that the old technology will fall out of favor, and more people will adapt the new technology

720P was once desirable, then 1080P, then 3D (which ultimately flopped after a short time)

Then 4K came along and was proven a success and now it's got a fair amount of uses in the form of UHD Blu-Ray players, Media Streaming, and 4K HDR Gaming

1080P is on it's way out, 4K will become standard, and 8K will become "Premium"

But I'm avoiding 8K for probably at least 5 years until it actually gets some supported formats and the 8K TVs become much cheaper; maybe then it will be worth buying one

But not at a huge price premium with nothing supporting it as of yet

Supposedly these new systems should be capable of 4K Resolution while staying at above 60FPS

That may not seem like much in the PC World, but also a lot of PC Gamers seem to stay in the 1080P to 1440P range while gaming at up to 100+ frames

You can get an amazing experience with a capable console, a great TV (my 49 Inch 4K SUHD Samsung was $800, that doesnt really break the bank in the realm of TVs and it does everything great), and enough room, and to me 4K is in kind of a sweet spot

You can have a Mid-Sized TV and actually see a big increase from 1080P to 4K in a reasonable size living room, something you cant do with the 8K Resolution as you would need a much bigger screen and along with that a much bigger room to properly see the resolution advantage

And that's only if/When supported formats come along

 

[boostergold]

I just hope with the ps5 they fix the fans. I have a PS4 that I got when it fist came out and it honestly sounds like a jet engine. It might just be that it's old but it's so loud. And recently started having trouble with it saying it's too hot and to turn it off when I'm playing certain games.

 

[BabyTyrant]

I just hope with the ps5 they fix the fans. I have a PS4 that I got when it fist came out and it honestly sounds like a jet engine. It might just be that it's old but it's so loud. And recently started having trouble with it saying it's too hot and to turn it off when I'm playing certain games.

I am with you there

I have an early PS4 Pro and much later after I got it I found out the newer PS4 Pros are a lot less noisy when it comes to the fans

Some games put my systems Fans into "Jet Engine" mode, but it hasnt gotten to the point of it saying the system is too hot and failing

Assuming there is some way to transfer Data from PS4 to PS5 I would love to get one at Launch if its reasonably priced

Particularly because they have stated it will have PS4 BC and have a "Pro" boosted mode for the Top Games, so I wont have to ditch my current game Library (which is why I usually wait 2 or 3 years to buy a new Generation System)