One of my famous rants, for your consideration. New info.

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SpAzpieSweeTot

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Consider these situations, picking fruit, pause button-less life adventures, long movies, illness, injury, surgery, especially in the car. Whad'ya do if you have a teenager in the car, who's sick, in pain, & is terrified to poop his pants, hmm?! As a kid, I was in the car with an older cousin, when it happened to him. I knew he was hurting, & wanted to tell him that if it hurt that badly, he could go ahead, but I wasn't sure it wouldn't get us both in trouble. He was so ashamed, & conditioned not to. It was sad. I never knew when it was okay not to torture my body, either.

Also in my childhood, a little girl got sick, & messed her pants at daycare. I was there to see her Daddy, of all people, give her the disappointed look, like she should know better. That's her Daddy, you know? Knight in shining armor? Daddy?! I had another friend, whom everyone called, "Taz, because her name started with T-A-S. Her ADHD was so bad, she literally couldn't pay attention long enough to remember she needed to pee. The other kids chanted, "Taz the Spaz, who pees her pants," at least once a day. In song, no less! Her parents didn't allow diapers, to shame her out of it. She'd tie her windbreaker around her waist, & I'd let her push me in my wheelchair.

It's our own darn faults. That's what we get for toiletshaming our kids! It's a training flaw! We teach kids diapers are the place to, "go," then take them away at some arbitrary age, instilling shame the whole time, with no regard for the fact that we've taken away the only potty place they've ever known! Do we have it wrong? Goodness yes! In other parts of the world, toilet learning starts at birth. Do they have it wrong? Goodness, yes!

What's my patented solution? From moment one, day one teach toilet, & diaper. Having a portable squat toilet wouldn't be bad either. Squatting is a healthier position. Watch for facial expressions & body postures. If signs of needing to "go," are shown, offer a potty, by holding the baby over it, or a diaper. Then cue them with special sound, one for pee, one for poop. It's called Modified Elimination Communication. Put diapers on at night, or when they're sick, or in the car, or whenever it fits the situation. Try to make it as even a split as possible between toilet, portable squat potty,& diaper, so they get that the idea is not to go in other places. Once they're big enough to understand, tell them the truth. If diapers were just for babies, they wouldn't be made big enough for adults?! Rather you need a diaper or not, it makes you no more, no less grown up. Make sure they know they aren't being shamed. It's just an acceptable option. If it was my future kid, I'd rather have a used diaper than wet, or messed undies; I don't care if they're 3, 13, or 103! A constipated, or sick kid, adult or not, wants a parent. What's wrong with letting them use a diaper, cuddled up with mom or dad, no matter the age? It hurts!

Intro real undies, when you know their signals, & they can ask or sign for a place to,"go." Explain that they're undies, not diapers, & poop & pee only go in a the toilet, their potty, or a diaper, but if they need one, they can ask. If an accident happens, remind them they can ask for a diaper. Potties & diapers are equal. This may mean fewer accidents, because "accident," gets redefined.

My theory is, if you add fear, shame, guilt or pain to something that can't be helped, it gets sexualized in some people, & becomes a natural personality trait in non-sexuals like me. so, if it's treated like a normal thing, maybe not. No skin off my nose if that's you thing, though. I get most DLs are sexual, I even understand it, but for me "Littling out," & sex don't mix. DL's another tale. Figured I'd clarify, since I've taken heat for speaking for others lately. Don't shoot me for a theory.

My next point is, why do cute, ecofriendly, non-carcinogenic, cute, quiet diapers stop after Abena Bambo Nature size 6 (XL)? They're the biggest I've seen. Has anyone seen bigger? Why not for those over 66 lbs.? Why punish them?! If girl's & women's undies can have cute hearts all over them, & they do, & no one calls that age-inappropriate, why not their diapers, & if normal boys, & young men get boyish undies, why not the boy who needs diapers?! I found cartoon jalapeños on the boxers of a 43 year old family member. Don't:censored::cursing:at me about age-inappropriate! Why can't a preteen, teen, or young adult diaper be easy on the planet, & for our bodies? Anti fungal, & antibacterial protection are in:eek:ldguy::sickinbed:diapers. Why not ours?!

So, up to 66 lbs., you're stuck with the same designs babies get, 'cause they're too cheap to acknowledge the older kids who need full diaper protection, & over 66 lbs., your choices are:eek:ldguy::sickinbed:diapers, or you're doomed to crinkle?! I'm not saying baby designs aren't okay. If that's a comfort thing for anyone, that's absolutely fine, but the mainstream diaper industry's message is, if we haven't learned to be ashamed by 66 lbs, we should've, & they'll drive the point home with:eek:ldguy::sickinbed:diapers?! Well, they should be ashamed! The rest of us are done!

My sister, who hasn't an ounce of AB/DL, wears full time, out of necessity. She's a full time wheelchair user, but isn't bound to a:censored::cursing:thing! I'm so proud of her! When she was little, Nanna made sure she had light-up shoes, so she'd move her feet & feel a bit more normal, & if I'd been part of the family when I was little, I would've gotten some too, for the same reasons, but when she outgrew baby diapers,:eek:ldguy::sickinbed:diapers it was! No normalcy for her! She tried not to let wearing bother her, but I have my own diaper horror stories, & for me, & a lot of our disabled friends, a cool design would've helped. For me, it still does.

People wonder why TB/AB/DLs are as we are, & have the nerve to call us weird?! We have no choice! This isn't true for everyone, & I no that, but I know why I'm a Little. I can remember every diaper related trauma I've ever had. The ones above are just a few, & my diaper options made it no better! If you wanna know, I've laid my heart open on other threads.

The TB/AB/DL side is kinda the same way as the mainstream diaper industry. There's no middle ground. Either the print's too babyish or you're stuck in plain white, but hey, no ugly wetness indicator. Hope you want crinkle, 'cause even clothlike Cushies do it, & Cushies are a girls only option, unless she wants to pay more for Cuddlez or Fabines. If you're a LB, & like crinkle, these are cool. They're the only middle ground I've found.[removed] Guess preteen, & teen girls, & young women, aren't worth cute, not-quite-baby diapers! According to Pamperchu, They're basically Cushies inside, but boyish designs, less turnaround time, because they're not ABU, adult Small=Boy's Large, adult Medium=Boy's XL, adult Large=Boy's XXL, & are apparently, Don't ask; Don't tell, if you're AB.

I'm not:eek:ldguy::sickinbed:I'm young, girly, spunky, & picky. If you wanna know what I want, check out the,"fantasy diaper," thread. If Lisa Frank could do heart designs, I'd want that. Every aspect of my ideal diaper's there to not set off my sensory & emotional issues. I despise crinkle, plastic, bulk, & love squish. Crinkle hurts my ears, & my feelings, & plastic & bulk feel weird. My best bet is a Tranquility SmartCore with aTopLiner booster pad, but then the anti fungal, & antibacterial protection isn't against my skin. The sides don't stretch, so they're hard to put on, they're a tad crinkly, & not a bit girly. I emailed a few ideas to them that they Thought were good enough for R & D, but they need a name & address, & I live at home.:frown: I wanna cry. That's my rant.
 
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bashfuldlguy

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GREAT RANT, sweetie!
I can identify with some of the things you have stated.
I am an overly-curious guy who has always wondered why? Why am I terminally DL?
I think you nailed it by stating that a lot of kids are shamed out of diapers.
I'm really starting to think that's what happened to me.
Since I was largely ignored by my parents, my diaper was probably the only "warm" feeling I had to hold on to.
I think that's why I still love them today. I crave the warmth of the experience. Sexual? You bet. Am I experiencing "diaper-shock?"
Thanks for your thread. Very good for you......!
 

dprlover90

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When I was in daycare, diapers were used as a punishment for wetting yourself and even for other reasons that had nothing to do with urinary functions. They saw diapers as a potential punishment, very embarresing to the child that made them behave well. And they mostly did.

This one time when I refused to go take a pee before naptime (I had gone earlier to the toilet, but the nurse didn't believe me), she said that she didn't want me to wet the bed because of a full bladder while sleeping and asked me would I rather go take a nap wearing pampers. I didn't want a diaper but neither could I pee, so she put me in diapers, even on the changing table to make it more embarresing. They were not like the diapers these days, those were bulky and the plastic crinkly, so no hope for discretion.

I believe this was the trigger to my DL nature that came so much later with my partial incontinence. Making diapers shameful and a punishment in childhood could very well have a connection to abdl.

And the funny thing is, that I would give anything to experience that situation again, but when that actually happened (me being around 5) it was the most horrible thing ever :D
 

bashfuldlguy

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Amen, dprlover.

And, I have to say that I envy you your memory! Being able to cull memories from way back is something I wish I could do. I think it would really help me to understand why I am the way I am.
The first DL-related memory I have is when I was in preschool at age four.
A lot of those kids were running around in cotton diapers and plastic pants (ooooh, yeah! Plastic pants. What a great invention! For some reason, whenever I think about them, my heart rate increases, and I get this certain "feeling" that just drives me nuts
I am a "PPL."
But, as is usual in all my posts, I digress......My memories come to me in "snapshots." I can't remember words spoken way back like you can.
Man-o-man, I envied those kids. Like crazy.
And, it's not gonna go away. Ever. Heck, I still envy kids I see, all diapered in their most-wonderful disposables.
Like you said, "I would give anything to experience that situation again." Jeez, man! You're readin' my mind...........The word "Anything" in your sentence says it all. Good for you!
Oh, and when I quoted you, I had to write-it-out word-for-word (how's that for hyphenation?) since I don't know how to do it the way the experts here do it. I got this machine almost two years ago and boy, what an adventure. I'm still learning.
Anyway, I agree with you.......
 
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Waddles

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Great rant SpAzpieSweeTot, where is the LIKE button when I need it most? :cool:
 

SpAzpieSweeTot

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Great rant SpAzpieSweeTot, where is the LIKE button when I need it most? :cool:
Lower left corner:lol:

image.jpgimage.jpgimage.jpgimage.jpg
Was my earlier point understood? It's like we have to be comfortable with baby prints, even if they shame us to death, so some of us do, because, shamefully or not, they were better than nothing, & if not, the only other option is medical-looking & flimsy. See what I mean? I'm so glad kids who're too young to even be self-aware, get to be treated with more dignity than I do! What baby's ridden a bike, or read a comic?!
 
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SpAzpieSweeTot

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Amen, dprlover.
I have to say that I envy you your memory! Being able to cull memories from way back is something I wish I could do. I think it would really help me to understand why I am the way I am.
The first DL-related memory I have is when I was in preschool at age four.
A lot of those kids were running around in cotton diapers and plastic pants (ooooh, yeah! Plastic pants. What a great invention!
I am a "PPL."
My memories come to me in "snapshots." I can't remember words spoken way back like you can.
Man-o-man, I envied those kids. Like crazy. Like you said, "I would give anything to experience that situation again." Jeez, man! You're readin' my mind. . .The word "Anything" in your sentence says it all. Good for you!
I guess, that's where I differ. I want, more than anything for someone to say, "You're my good, sweet girl, & I love you. You've done nothing to feel guilty about, or ashamed of. There's no need for fear, & the pain will stop! See my red cape? I'll make it stop! It's okay. Just let go." Then again, if it ever happened, I'd probably cry & not stop, like that scene from, "Good Will Hunting."
 
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I purchased some Abenas and Molicares recently...and this thread really resonates with me.

I KNOW these are supposed to be really good diapers, but they aren't satisfying in any way...they feel "skimpy" with the thin cut in the center, and they look medical as heck with their wetness indicators and cheap-feeling cloth wings. I don't have much trust in them (even though they have not ever leaked), and wouldn't want my (abdl-accepting) bf to see me in them.

It has been at least...wow...at least three years since I've had disposables. I was disappointed back then (Bambinos were close...but not quite there), and this recent experience is a reminder of why I took the time to design my own cloth diapers. I have the freedom to design the cut as comfortably wide as I need it, with as many colorful PUL prints as I wish on the cover, and with whatever tape and other functional design as desired. The only thing I don't like about my diapers are how bulky they are and how much of a pain they are to clean...I would hop on an opportunity to design a disposable version of what I've got, if that opportunity ever materialized.
 

SpAzpieSweeTot

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View attachment 20735View attachment 20736View attachment 20738View attachment 20737
On the topic, see what I mean? I'm so glad kids who're too young to even be self-aware, get to be treated with more dignity than I do! What baby's ride a bike, or read a comic?!
Another thing. Diapers,image.jpgoh my goodness, still diapersimage.jpg

briefsimage.jpg 'nough said? Coverup talk ticks me off! Nurses'll say it preserves dignity. Does not! Does not! Does not! It tells me I should be ashamed, cause babies wear diapers! Wanna know what preserves my dignity? Fit, performance, color, pattern, & quiet! Not that I get those things!
 
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MegaChar

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Interesing...

A different perspective on the idea of elimination communication.When I learned about what some parents were doing. Man I got pissed off.


Kids at that young of age arn't really adware about there world much untill age 3-5 and even then, most dont want to give up many of the things that they had as babies because of insiqueritys and the expectations of growing up[They are expected to grow up but they dont want to.


I feel this is personally why most boys dont want to give up diapers when potty training comes just becase the kids are so used to being in them and it relates to how they "go" that it scares them that they have to give up somthing they been in for all of there little lives and I also dislike how kids are potty trained.

Trained to hate the very thing that they been using and making it look like its been bad to them the whole time....Its deffonally a sucitity thing. Conditioning kids to hate things that they will mostly be in later in life.


It ISNT RIGHT and i agree on the idea thats great for those who are a bit hessiant of a diaperfull childhood or a diaper free baby...Just give the idea two voiding mediums options right at birth.
 

SpAzpieSweeTot

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I'd love to design my own 'sposies' with cute prints. With CP, & an ASD, there's a market. Finding diapers that are easy to put on for those with hand dexterity issues, that don't annoy those with sensory issues is hard! when you fit someone like that for a taped, or pull-up diaper, protection level, fit, hand dexterity, sensory needs, cognitive /social /emotional age, & size, must all be considered.
Ifimage.jpgwas utterly silent,more ecofriendly, held 38 oz., had curved leg elastics, &

wide stretchy sides likeimage.jpgexcept they matched a 3D-looking heart pattern, that'd be my ideal. When it's on, it should 'split the difference' between a diaper & a pull-up. See how the Velcro is hidden under side panel material? Bet that'd keep it from scratching. If the Velcro matched the pattern, that'd be even better. If fade-when-wet designs exist, why are we stuck with ugly wetness indicators? Why medical blue, medical green, or plain white, & that's it?! Molicares are purple, but plastic backed, & crinkly!
Look, the only thing depend ever got right. Colors!image.jpgimage.jpg

A different perspective on the idea of elimination communication.When I learned about what some parents were doing. Man I got pissed off.

I feel this is personally why most boys dont want to give up diapers when potty training comes just becase the kids are so used to being in them and it relates to how they "go" that it scares them that they have to give up somthing they been in for all of there little lives and I also dislike how kids are potty trained.

Sometimes, I wonder if parents think about how independent they want kids to be. Some kids can't button, snap, or zip until 5 or older. Most western parents that do E.C. still use diapers. Thank goodness! Interestingly enough, shame cannot develop before a child can recognize himself or herself in a mirror, because they realize they're individuals. That happens at 1 1/2 to 2 years old, & that's why they hide to go. They've never seen anyone else go, so they think only they do it. How cute. People with ASDs (Aspergers is autism. Don't let docs fool you.) find this a sticking point. For them, information they need is missing. How does what I make get from in me, to in the toilet? So they may squat right next to or in front of the toilet, undiapered & "go" For one boy I know of, it "clicked" when he was riding a horse & saw another one poop. Traditional toilet training has 4 stages. 1 I'm blissfully unaware that anyone may take issue with my diapers, because I've used them all my life. 2 I understand that the adults around me, for some reason, don't like my diapers anymore, but I dunno what to do; that's why they hide. 3 I know what they want me to do, but I'm no pro. Think "learners permit." 4 I've got it down.

Parents often don't realize the have pre, mid, or post diaper change routines, but before a diaper change, parents may give a comfort object, or toy, mid diaper change, the parent may point to the wall border, & ask what color the doggy is, or use that time to "catch up" with the kid, & maybe there's a post-change cuddle. Now, what do you think happens, if all those loving things stop because of darn toilet training? The kid thinks he or she is losing mom, & dad. Not good. Bring the toy the kid was playing with to the restroom, if possible, or make sure no one puts it away, & tell them it'll be there when he or she gets back. Post-potty chats or cuddles are good.

If you have a boy, & hear the toilet seat slam, & he runs screaming that the toilet bit him, expect a setback. Other kids are worried about being unstable on the toilet, or are afraid of the flushing noise, or how cold restrooms are, especially if they have sensory or coordinative issues.

Another thing parents do without realizing the absurdity, is to allow the child who's used to diapers to stay in them, when the parent doesn't want them used, & then say, "You know it goes in the potty!" For that kid, diapers are acceptable toilets. Get it?! I've also seen a little one, about 2ish, diapered, sick with diarrhea in the car. Daddy, driving the car, sees her hurting & crying, & tells her it's okay to use her diaper, but idiot mommy, in the backseat with her, says to wait. Stop mixing signals!

If I ever have kids, these are the rules for diapers.

1 Make fun of your brother or sister for a missed toiletunity, or diapey leak, & congratulations; you inherit his or her laundry for a week!

2 Your diapey designs, & rather you want taped ones or pull-ups, are yours to pick, even if you want undies on the outside, so if you need one, ask. It's okay. We won't make you feel bad.

3 Mommy & daddy wouldn't put you in a diapey, if using it wasn't okay. When your sick, hurt, sleeping, or away from a restroom, we don't want you hurting yourselves just to get to a toilet. We'll never stop you from trying to get there, so if you think you can, try, but be smart. There're times when you have to get out of your carseat, into another place, find a toilet, manage clothes, & sit down. So, if you can't do all that, don't be ashamed to use your diapies. I don't care if you have to do the "diapey squat" in the middle of the mall. We'll tell gawkers too back off.:lol:

4 If you leak, even if undiapered, no biggie, just stay in one place. Cleanup is easier that way.

5 Once you're going, you'll need a change anyway, so finish what you start, & always tell one of us if you need a change, even if you don't use words.

6 You get 1 "on purpose" in just your undies. After that, we don't have to help you.
 
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bashfuldlguy

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I guess, that's where I differ. I want, more than anything for someone to say, "You're my good, sweet girl, & I love you. You've done nothing to feel guilty about, or ashamed of. There's no need for fear, & the pain will stop! See my red cape? I'll make it stop! It's okay. Just let go." Then again, if it ever happened, I'd probably cry & not stop, like that scene from, "Good Will Hunting."
Yeah, that part really scares me. I'd probably cry & not stop, if I actually had someone to reassure me and say that things are gonna be OK. I want that really badly.
 

giantguy99

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You know I was wondering I wanted to expand on that part about being shamed with diapers to include something else. Would it be inappropriate to think that shaming a child at all is just plain wrong? I suspect it is but I am not to sure and could use a 2nd opinion about it.
 

SpAzpieSweeTot

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Loved the rant, dude :claps:
Dudette; I'm a girl.:giggles:

- - - Updated - - -

Would it be inappropriate to think that shaming a child at all is just plain wrong? I suspect it is but I am not to sure and could use a 2nd opinion about it.
It depends, did the kid break a commandment? (An actual biblical one, as opposed to my rules) If not, then shaming them is wrong. If so, they might not need help from you. They may be ashamed all on their own.
 
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giantguy99

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Dudette; I'm a girl.:giggles:

- - - Updated - - -

It depends, did the kid break a commandment? (An actual biblical one, as opposed to my rules) If not, then shaming them is wrong. If so, they might not need help from you. They may be ashamed all on their own.

Well I am not thinking anything specific more like a good general rule. I do believe this to be true but I check the credibility of everything I say usually before using it. I am only vaguely and thus naively aware of the truth of it being a bad idea to shame a child at all and I was just thinking I could learn more about that from you. I know your younger then me SpAzpieSweeTot but we can all learn something from each other and it seems you have some useful wisdom that piqued my curiosity so I figured I could ask. I suspect there's always a better way to teach a kid a lesson that does not involve shaming them in any way but it occurs to me that I know very little on the subject and I was hoping to learn some more.
 

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There used to be a running joke in the school where I worked. It was this: the best three teaching techniques are shame, blame and sarcasm. We'd laugh because the temptation was always with us, but we tried desperately not to go there.

I've said for years on this site that I believe bad potty training may be a contributing factor to why we now like wearing diapers.
 

SpAzpieSweeTot

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Well I am not thinking anything specific more like a good general rule. I do believe this to be true but I check the credibility of everything I say usually before using it. I am only vaguely and thus naively aware of the truth of it being a bad idea to shame a child at all and I was just thinking I could learn more about that from you. I know your younger then me SpAzpieSweeTot but we can all learn something from each other and it seems you have some useful wisdom that piqued my curiosity so I figured I could ask. I suspect there's always a better way to teach a kid a lesson that does not involve shaming them in any way but it occurs to me that I know very little on the subject and I was hoping to learn some more.
You're right, there are better ways. A good general rule is, don't provoke your children to anger, which deliberately shaming them does. Think before you act, & use natural consequences.
 

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You're right, there are better ways. A good general rule is, don't provoke your children to anger, which deliberately shaming them does. Think before you act, & use natural consequences.

Yeah that's my problem I know this stuff but I don't know how to put it into words effectively. That's why I ask even though I know what's up. I just need to see it with my own eyes to understand how to speak it.
 
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