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Thread: Goth on a lead denied use of public transport

  1. #1

    Default Goth on a lead denied use of public transport

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...3/ngoth123.xml

    I found this article quite interesting and it has been under heated debate on quite a few websites that I visit. I was wondering what people thought here about these things and if people think that they should be allowed to use a lead in public.

    It made me think that intolerance of things like this from the public might be a sign of intolerance of fetishes and alternative things from people. Also it made me wonder if this had any connection with us or me as a DL in the way people would react if I was either discovered or came out to certain people...

    Discuss...

  2. #2

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    (lead=leash if anyone's wondering)

    I think the bus company make a good point about the safety hazards of wearing a lead on the bus. :p
    Although:
    "We are writing to Mr Graves to apologise for any distress caused by the way this matter was handled"

    That means that the bus driver was a pr*ck, who basically told them to F-off just because he didn't agree with what they're doing.

    I don't know what I think about it... I'm inclined to take the side that bus driver isn't on, because you get so much attitude of bus drivers I've grown to despise some of them as much as they despise the world. But actually, I think you shouldn't go around wearing a lead on a bus... buses are filled with old people and kids, and they don't need to see that! It's pushing your fetish into other people's faces.

    (And who takes a dog on a bus? Come on, you're meant to be taking it for a walk!)

  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie F View Post
    the bus driver was a pr*ck, who basically told them to F-off just because he didn't agree with what they're doing.
    I agree, if I were the driver, I might have thought to myself that they seem a little weird, but I wouldn't have denied them like that!

  4. #4

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    I can't believe it.
    I've some goth friends but they are allowed to use public transport .
    The driver must have a very closed mind

  5. #5

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    I have to take the side of the bus company (although the bus driver might have handled it a little more politely...if indeed those were his words). A lead around the neck is a hazard not only to the person wearing it but to other people on the bus.

    That said, I would have no problems if the person was using a lead similar to those used on children (and dogs too) which is a harness with the lead attached at the back. It's still 'dog like' without being hazardous to one's health.

  6. #6

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    I agree with aya, it's dangerous and... I'd be kinda freaked out if I saw someone like this in the bus.

  7. #7

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    Personally I think they have every right to have a lead and use it. I think there is hardly any safety issue and the only reason they said that was to cover the bus driver's back and stop it looking like blatant discrimination.

    It doesn't harm anyone else and it isn't overtly obscene therefore I think the bus driver was 100% at fault.

  8. #8
    Peachy

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    I've seen two goth girls, one leading the other on a leash (seen them twice, several weeks apart). I didn't think it was too strange. I also fail to see how that could pose a harm to other passengers. I've seen people taking whole wardrobes, crates of beer, a kazillion animals and what not on buses or streetcars, and no one gave a crap.
    Unfortunately, I agree with Charlie - most drivers do have an attitude and think they own the world, just because they own the button for the doors. I'm glad I rarely have to face them, as most of them don't know their own company's rules.
    Personally, I think the driver deserves a swift kick in the ass and, as punishement, has to spend a day on a leash.

    By the way: When I first read the title of this thread, I thought it was someone on a leash claiming she was a dog and only wanting to pay dog fare on the bus.

    Peachy

  9. #9

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    I've been a part of the Baltimore "goth" scene for a long time and I've seen that kind of stuff every weekend for the past ten years. I've also slowly begun to become disenchanted with the "goth" scene, for as I've gotten older (and hopefully a bit more wise), I've realized just how absolutely inane this freedom of expression is that so many "goth" people cling to.

    People would think I'm a poser "goth" -- is that because I wear khakis and button-downs when I go to work and decide to look socially presentable when I'm in public? I don't know. I reserve the black clothes and chains and metal for the club-scene and when I'm playing shows. Otherwise, when I leave that club, I leave my "goth" persona behind. Why? Because people judge me if I dress like that. I expect them to.

    I take the side of the bus company on this. If you want to lead somebody around on a leash in public, then you should certainly expect the social repercussions. There needs to be a line drawn between what you do in the privacy of your own home and in the company or your friends and what is generally socially acceptable.

    Would I go out in public with the waist-line of a diaper clearly visible above my pants so that others could see? No, I wouldn't -- but if I did, I would expect people to look at me strangely. I don't see this situation much differently.

    I agree with Ayanna's expression about safety. There are too many liabilities there.

    If I could talk to the girl and her boyfriend? I don't care if you're "so goth you're dead", I don't care if you want to live like a dog. At least have enough respect for yourself to know that not everyone is going to accept a public display of bondage like that.

    ... and if you want to be treated like a dog? Remember, most public transportation in America doesn't allow large pets on board, either.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by ayanna View Post
    I have to take the side of the bus company (although the bus driver might have handled it a little more politely...if indeed those were his words). A lead around the neck is a hazard not only to the person wearing it but to other people on the bus.

    That said, I would have no problems if the person was using a lead similar to those used on children (and dogs too) which is a harness with the lead attached at the back. It's still 'dog like' without being hazardous to one's health.
    I agree with the driver on safety grounds too - but not according to some arbitrary interpretation of dress code. If one of the couple tripped and choked the transit co. would be held partially accountable. Just as if the driver allowed someone with an untethered dog on and it bit someone. What if the bus crashed? A leash (or lead in the UK) could certainly contribute to injuries.

    As to the dogs and freaks comment, the driver is totally out of line and should be dunned for that comment.

    Funnily enough, among people whose costume is a badge of their particular subculture I have found that goths keep to themselves and don't cause trouble. I used to frequent a bar where live roleplayers met weekly, and most of them came to play Masquerade (vampire game) dressed appropriately. Many got into the game as an adjunct to full-time gothery. Others were just gamers dressed for the part. There was never any trouble among them or between them and the regular patrons... The bar even sold red-tinted beer, for a little extra... The bar was a mainstream chain restaurant. (I suspect the management had a deal with the Ventrue to keep an eye on the Malkavians... lol)

    Back to the bus: collars are fine; collars with big spikes are not: and so on. The transit authority is responsible for people not hurting themselves or others accidentally within their power to prevent such. If a country has a subway a leash could cause the dom & sub to be caught either side of the door, and dragged off, so obviously that would be a nono. And a rule on the subway would extend to surface transport since it would be a company-wide policy.
    Schools here have taken to banning faddish toys (pogs, pokemon cards, bey-blades) - anything where the gameplay involves one kid ending up with the play-pieces of the other: plainly trouble waiting to happen. So 17 year olds can find their pokemon cards confiscated if they play them during a spare. And they might be, like, wtf? We're 17 & causing no trouble, and mature enough to be responsible players... and the school is like, it is a school-wide policy, enacted for specific circumstances but applied generally. If we let you play then the 14 yo's will cry foul; if we let them play the 10 yo's will cry...
    You might cry that a policy that is sensible on the subway that isn't sensible on the bus should be waived. But corporations (public or otherwise) prefer to have simple policies; having exceptions causes confusion.
    Last edited by Raccoon; 04-Feb-2008 at 23:38.

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