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Thread: Toyota acclerator problems? Think again....

  1. #1

    Default Toyota acclerator problems? Think again....

    Early Tests Pin Toyota Accidents on Drivers

    Crash Data Suggest Driver Error in Toyota Accidents - WSJ.com

    Kinda hits home as a tech, but it's no surprise either. So far it looks like they're safe to drive...as long as the driver knows the difference between the gas and the brake

  2. #2
    Butterfly Mage

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    I think I'll stick to my Honda Insight-II, regardless of what Toyota says.

  3. #3

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    I never thought that my Jeep would be safer to drive than a Toyota. I think that some of the data linking Toyota to mechanical malfunctions has merit. Certainly their floor mats were a problem. I believe it left physical evidence that was traceable to the mat. Even Toyota admitted that they had trouble with the software that controlled the acceleration. It used to be that there was a wire that went from the accelerator pedal to the carburetor. There was a return spring that countered the accelerator wire. But now this is all electronically done, and of course we have fuel injection, not carburetors.

    Toyota made a statement several months ago that the software which ran the accelerator mechanism was something that their own design engineers didn't comprehend. Apparently a third party designed it. It points out that cars are continuing to get more and more complicated. Ahhhhhhh!

    edit: Having made the crack about my Jeep, I thought that this statement was only fair. When I bought my Jeep new, it didn't take long before I noticed it had a tendency to speed up all on its own. I called the dealer and sure enough, there was a recall out on it. They did have to replace a part, so this is not a problem only associated with Toyota. Maybe the same software programmer provided the programming for a number of car manufacturers.

  4. #4

  5. #5

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    a lot of the talk around here isn't about the software having issues, but the mechanical parts themselves. If there was a software problem there would be an update for it by now. The problem has to do with the mechanics inside the pedal itself and the fix for it is a simple shim under a spring that reduces friction between the parts (long story, but i've seen it first hand). As for the floormats being lethal, toyota messed up on that for sure, but now they're not holding back. If an owner has multiple or aftermarket floormats in their car and come in complaining of "unintended acceleration" then toyota is going to look the other way. Why? Because their cars were designed with only ONE floormat in mind. Silly as it may sound, it's true.

    As for the redesign of cars over the years, many factors are involved. Before we had the old fashion cable running from the gas pedal to the throttle body, carb, etc. Today most of them are electronically controlled via stepper motors connected to the throttle body and controlled through the use of electronics. Reason being is not only can you control vehicle speed, cruise control and traction control can be incorporated in the same unit. Electronics are pretty much taking over our cars, so get used to it. The sad part is this leaves the DIY type of person in the dust of wires and confusion.

  6. #6

    Wink



    Quote Originally Posted by TallestBabyEver View Post
    Early Tests Pin Toyota Accidents on Drivers

    Kinda hits home as a tech, but it's no surprise either. So far it looks like they're safe to drive...as long as the driver knows the difference between the gas and the brake
    I had little doubt that it would come to this, having memories of Audi's rather similar situation.

    Most drivers have a vague idea as to how things work. People who fancy themselves as computer literate seemingly (inexplicably) think they know more, which is why the tech press seemed to glomb on to this situation so much. I recall reading someone who felt that all automotive sotfware needed open public review. Man I busted a gut after reading that.

    Ahead is probably tl;dr

    Automobiles, to those without experience with development, design, production, distribution or repair are bewildering. When I still wrenched the number of owners that attributed problems to their cars that didn't exist were numerous. exempli gratia,

    A gentlemen, whose then new '88 Mitsubishi Starion had a light on the instrument panel that said WASH, brought his car into a dealership one of my good school friends worked at. His complaint was that the 'paint sensor or paint itself was faulty', seemingly because it didn't go out no matter how many times he washed his car. (It was a washer fluid level light)

    At the shop I worked at we had a guy bring in his 6 month old Lexus for a driveline vibration, the dealer had found nothing wrong the prior week. This was December and we were having snow regularly. Our shop also didn't find any problems, yet the owner was adamant that there was a SEVERE problem. I elected to drive along with him, but instead of me driving, he drove. On a side note, I would later find out he had been part of the Control Data Corporation design team for their CYBER supercomputers. ANYWAY, in less than a block we reached a 3 way stop and he pounced on the brake, and the car stuttered and shuddered to a straight, swift stop. The 'problem' was the anti-lock brakes activating on the icy intersection and completely normal.

    In the end I viewed these Toyota reports by owners to be largely errors on the drivers part.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by babibear View Post
    I had little doubt that it would come to this, having memories of Audi's rather similar situation.

    Most drivers have a vague idea as to how things work. People who fancy themselves as computer literate seemingly (inexplicably) think they know more, which is why the tech press seemed to glomb on to this situation so much. I recall reading someone who felt that all automotive sotfware needed open public review. Man I busted a gut after reading that.

    Ahead is probably tl;dr

    Automobiles, to those without experience with development, design, production, distribution or repair are bewildering. When I still wrenched the number of owners that attributed problems to their cars that didn't exist were numerous. exempli gratia,

    A gentlemen, whose then new '88 Mitsubishi Starion had a light on the instrument panel that said WASH, brought his car into a dealership one of my good school friends worked at. His complaint was that the 'paint sensor or paint itself was faulty', seemingly because it didn't go out no matter how many times he washed his car. (It was a washer fluid level light)

    At the shop I worked at we had a guy bring in his 6 month old Lexus for a driveline vibration, the dealer had found nothing wrong the prior week. This was December and we were having snow regularly. Our shop also didn't find any problems, yet the owner was adamant that there was a SEVERE problem. I elected to drive along with him, but instead of me driving, he drove. On a side note, I would later find out he had been part of the Control Data Corporation design team for their CYBER supercomputers. ANYWAY, in less than a block we reached a 3 way stop and he pounced on the brake, and the car stuttered and shuddered to a straight, swift stop. The 'problem' was the anti-lock brakes activating on the icy intersection and completely normal.

    In the end I viewed these Toyota reports by owners to be largely errors on the drivers part.
    You would think that as cars advance they become easier to drive. designer's these days try to make the cars as "idiot proof" as possible. And yet despite the designer's and engineer's efforts, another level of idiocy comes along and brings the bar down another level. Im not bashing all toyota owners or all driver's in general, it's just a never ending cycle of car design.

    When a problem does arise then the engineer's and designers go back to the board and try it again. They bring out their improved product, an "idiot" breaks the barrier again, and the cycle repeats.

  8. #8

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    One of my cars is, or was technically affected by this recall and I intentionally had no intent to get it fixed. Why you might ask? Because as a good driver I know that the brake can overpower the engine at full throttle... easily. I proved this to a co-worker while in the car. Also, I'm one of the rare breed of American's who choose to shift my own gears. Worst case scenario I just press the clutch and the car will slow down. It is idiots who have tarnished Toyota's reputation based on their own stupidity. Toyota makes a damn reliable automobile and anyone who can't figure out how to stop their car in an emergency just shouldn't have a driver's license.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by TallestBabyEver View Post
    You would think that as cars advance they become easier to drive. designer's these days try to make the cars as "idiot proof" as possible. And yet despite the designer's and engineer's efforts, another level of idiocy comes along and brings the bar down another level. Im not bashing all toyota owners or all driver's in general, it's just a never ending cycle of car design.

    When a problem does arise then the engineer's and designers go back to the board and try it again. They bring out their improved product, an "idiot" breaks the barrier again, and the cycle repeats.
    "Advanced" and "Complex" do not always mean safer, better, or more reliable. The more parts and functions you have in any machine, the more opportunities you have for failure.

    Think back to high school geometry. The simplest solution is regarded as the best. For all the alleged improvements in engine management, mileage and efficiency aren't any better than they were 20 years ago because the weight and power requirements of all the added gadgets have offset any gains.

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