New AB/DL diaper on the market - Bumooza

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CuddleWoozle said:
My humble name suggestion without completely changing the name? Flip the m and z. "Buzooma!" It sounds like Buzz and Zoomer. Which sounds exciting. ;D (And not at all what you would have happen after too many nakie chicken tacos. :laugh:)
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Seriously not a bad idea. Of course, I had the brilliant foresight of putting "Bumooza" on the diaper itself! I'm going to keep this suggestion on my shortlist. Thank you.

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dogstyle said:
Looks like someone spent 10c each on a bulk order from china. I am skeptical on the 5000ML rating.
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There were indeed cheaper options available, though none approaching that price. After having sampled the cheaper options, I wouldn't dare put them on the market myself. If you're going to take the time to do something, it's better just to do it right. I think of it like this - could you replace a head gasket on a car with a part that costs 1/5th the name brand part? You could, but you're still investing 10+ hours of time to do the head gasket either way. A wiser investment would be to go with the quality part from the outset so that the effort will not be wasted.

The 5000ML rating comes from the manufacturer. Would you be able to see this in practice? Probably not. I think it best serves as an indicator of being on par with other competing diapers marketed (when done so in good faith) as being 5000ML. Like a good Wi-Fi router, there are theoretical maximum speeds and practical speeds you see in real life, the latter of which is influenced heavily by real world applications.
 
NeverKnow said:
I don't think the design is too bad, but two things I wish ABDL companies did more often would be hiring professional artists and consulting the community (or at least a panel--I understand it's nice for it to be a bit of a surprise) before releasing a design.
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For me, I quickly realized that there are a ton of moving parts and variables involved in creating even a "micro" sized company with one product. It's a lot to manage! I had considered consulting a community panel, but having a design panel would be adding even more variables into the equation. For the first run, I wanted to keep things simple so to speak. The artwork on the design was created by a professional artist and adapted to the product. I lack the ability to create decent vector artwork myself beyond the basics!

In the future, I think you're right. Utilizing community feedback will be the strongest approach going forward, and I plan to do this. Thank you for your continued input!
 
It seems I better buy a case of these diapers before the community bashes this design to death. We all know how that goes, a design disappears and THEN people want it.
 
paddedcowboy said:
It seems I better buy a case of these diapers before the community bashes this design to death. We all know how that goes, a design disappears and THEN people want it.
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I'm not bashing it, it's still cute. :3 I like the idea of the animals and the alphabet.

Anything I offer up should be taken as a critique, meant to offer suggestions for improvement in the future. ;D (Now, I have seen some truly awful designs that I am glad are dead and gone. Not mentioning my least favorite because a lot of other people actually loved it. :laugh:)
 
BumoozaOfficial said:
Seriously not a bad idea. Of course, I had the brilliant foresight of putting "Bumooza" on the diaper itself! I'm going to keep this suggestion on my shortlist. Thank you.

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There were indeed cheaper options available, though none approaching that price. After having sampled the cheaper options, I wouldn't dare put them on the market myself. If you're going to take the time to do something, it's better just to do it right. I think of it like this - could you replace a head gasket on a car with a part that costs 1/5th the name brand part? You could, but you're still investing 10+ hours of time to do the head gasket either way. A wiser investment would be to go with the quality part from the outset so that the effort will not be wasted.

The 5000ML rating comes from the manufacturer. Would you be able to see this in practice? Probably not. I think it best serves as an indicator of being on par with other competing diapers marketed (when done so in good faith) as being 5000ML. Like a good Wi-Fi router, there are theoretical maximum speeds and practical speeds you see in real life, the latter of which is influenced heavily by real world applications.
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First, best of luck and hope you do well in growing the business. That said - here's another angle to look at dogstyles comment..

I could see it coming off as "cheap" because you used a common PE printing design with the 3D blue contouring effect, added in some babyish artwork and slapped your logo on it.. If it wasn't for that logo there would be no brand identity.. This is then coupled with alienation of customers by having it come to market in only one size because the manufacture told you they wouldn't do multiple size diapers for the quantity order / price point.. I could go on, but that's why it "Looks like someone spent 10c each on a bulk order from china. I am skeptical on the 5000ML rating".
 
relaedataris said:
First, best of luck and hope you do well in growing the business. That said - here's another angle to look at dogstyles comment..

I could see it coming off as "cheap" because you used a common PE printing design with the 3D blue contouring effect, added in some babyish artwork and slapped your logo on it.. If it wasn't for that logo there would be no brand identity.. This is then coupled with alienation of customers by having it come to market in only one size because the manufacture told you they wouldn't do multiple size diapers for the quantity order / price point.. I could go on, but that's why it "Looks like someone spent 10c each on a bulk order from china. I am skeptical on the 5000ML rating".
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Sure, no worries. Thank you for the perspective.
 
BumoozaOfficial said:
The 5000ML rating comes from the manufacturer. Would you be able to see this in practice? Probably not.
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It's definitely not. The way they get the rating is to weigh the diaper, immerse it in water for several minutes, then weigh it again and take the difference. Even when taken with a massive grain of salt and understanding that it's a standardized test for all the diapers on the market, it still has some major flaws:

1) SAP is actually neutralized by salt, so that means that diapers will a high SAP content will be inaccurately rated as better compared to diapers with more wood pulp (or even diapers that do something fancy to counteract the salt).

2) past a certain point, the actual distribution of the fluff and the absorption properties of the specific mixture will have more of an effect than raw capacity. e.g. a diaper that holds less but aquires liquid quickly vs holding more but aquiring slower.

3) a bunch of other stuff I can't remember because it's 3am, but you probably get the point.

Diaper testing is actually a really fascinating subject, as the industry hasn't really improved on it in the last several decades since no one has really agreed on a standard. iirc there's some really good resources on adisc with an attempt at standardizing some more more realistic and repeatable diaper testing methods.
 
I feel like a field test (if you will) is the most viable test. Put it on, drink water to stay well hydrated, and do something moderately active. That will get the best review you could ask for. This method tells the durability and capacity as well. By doing this I can tell you if the tapes hold up, if the shell holds up, if the padding clumps, and how good the product wicks away the wettings. You can also test the possibility of having a leak by wetting while sitting. It’s a pretty solid review method.


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Taking into account the limited manufacturing capabilities for ABDL Diaper manufacturers, the small number of them, and the fact that a vast majority of their products are pretty much identical (except for the prints)...what exactly makes your product "new"? You claim that "quality is king", and that you have to take "your time to do it right". What is "right"? What kind of "quality" are you offering that differs from the established suppliers? What features do you offer that others don't? Why is your product different? Are you offering a similar product but with a revamped ordering/buying system? Does your product compare favorably with the plethora of competitors that also have 5000ml capacities? What is you intended market? Who are you going to be using as a shipping partner?

I've heard a lot of "hype", but I haven't seen anything of substance; no data or any specifics of the product. No testimonials, no trials, nothing other than "hello, I'm selling something new". I am also concerned with the one size offered. It's all circumstantial, but it all sort of leads me to the same conclusion others have made that a bulk order to alibaba or China was made, and now someone has a container full of product they need to push.

However, this may just be due to a slightly premature release of information? I'm hoping that this is legitimate, and I look forward to seeing what you may be bringing to market that differs or improves upon existing options.
 
If I may please politely ask... Is there a way I can see a website for product updates? Do you have a webpage of any sorts? (I am interested in at least trying them)
 
Llayden said:
It's all circumstantial, but it all sort of leads me to the same conclusion others have made that a bulk order to alibaba or China was made, and now someone has a container full of product they need to push
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To add to your thought - seeing as it has custom printing, it's considered OEM. In order to source an OEM order, the manufacture has special requirements as they need to keep their operations optimized. IE: machines running, labor, etc. For example, they may require a 20ft cargo container worth of inventory per size, as that allotment would mean machine and workers are running a full day. Unless you have a strong relationship with the company, they may not be willing to say 1/2 can be mediums, and the other 1/2 of the container can be large due to machines being down during alterations needed to manufacture the other size. If the new company only has enough capital to purchase the 20ft container, they'll release a one size fits most approach.. then after selling through the initial inventory, they may have the required capital for a 40ft shipping container worth of inventory that can be multiple sizes.
 
LilacCrinkle said:
If I may please politely ask... Is there a way I can see a website for product updates? Do you have a webpage of any sorts? (I am interested in at least trying them)
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Sure, the website is here:

bumooza.com

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Llayden, my response to your post is pretty long winded, so Tl;Dr - if you're skeptical, don't believe the hype, wait for community reviews, and always make an informed purchasing decision

Llayden said:
Taking into account the limited manufacturing capabilities for ABDL Diaper manufacturers, the small number of them, and the fact that a vast majority of their products are pretty much identical (except for the prints)...what exactly makes your product "new"? You claim that "quality is king", and that you have to take "your time to do it right". What is "right"? What kind of "quality" are you offering that differs from the established suppliers? What features do you offer that others don't? Why is your product different? Does your product compare favorably with the plethora of competitors that also have 5000ml capacities? What is you intended market?
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I got a similar question on the Reddit thread. Here was my response:

BumoozaOfficial said:
Hey there, thanks for the question [as to what sets these diapers apart]. I would say two things - the design and the quality of the diaper / materials.

Regarding the design, the intention was to create something as realistic as possible given current manufacturing limitations, with soft colors and lots of white. Of course, design is a personal preference, but I hope the community enjoys it!

Secondly, regarding quality, we chose the most experienced diaper manufacturer we could find to source our custom design from, and then maxed out the absorbency specs. There were manufacturers offering lower prices than the one we chose, but we explicitly chose what we felt was the best manufacturer available (which also happened to be the most expensive). Reason being, we wanted our "Debut" diaper to be as good as possible! I believe our supplier is the same one used for other AB/DL companies' high end diapers, but it seems like ours is lower priced than our competitors.

To summarize, we offer a new design paired with what we believe is the best AB/DL diaper (material-wise) available.
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Without going into too much detail, this has been a year long project of contacting suppliers, sampling all available products in our niche, submitting and revising designs, website building, etc. This is a project I take very seriously, I do not like to cut corners in anything I do, especially with a product that will be associated with a brand I now represent.

Another question of yours:

Llayden said:
Are you offering a similar product but with a revamped ordering/buying system?
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There are two aspects of my business that I'm proud of in this respect. The first was choosing a distribution company that is able to ship product to customers in roughly 3 business days to 60% of the population of the United States. This tripled my sea freight costs, but I hope it ends up being worth it.

The second being the website. I understand it's not perfect, but I feel it is easy to navigate and use. Customers are offered competitive and transparent "1 size fits all" prices and an easy online shopping experience.

Is this unique? No, ecommerce is not a breakout market - it's had plenty of time to mature and evolve. That being said, I still view it as essential to spend the time to create an attractive and streamlined site. The community will be the judge of course, but I think for the most part this as achieved.

I don't view ordering / buying systems as a pain point in our industry as a whole. Like I said, ecommerce has been a thing for a long time now, and I would say most competitors are doing a good job here - there is nothing I can find about any competitors websites that would actively determe from buying their products if I were interested in them. Having said this, I don't see this as a place where innovation is needed for our community, but if anyone disagrees, please let me know so I can be the one to do it!

Llayden said:
I've heard a lot of "hype", but I haven't seen anything of substance; no data or any specifics of the product. No testimonials, no trials, nothing other than "hello, I'm selling something new".
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If you're skeptical, I'd wait until the community starts receiving and reviewing the product. That will be the ultimate judge in my eyes. Other than that, the only thing I have to offer you are the details on the product page, and I can do my best to answer any other specific questions you have.

This is also the reason why I'm offering a 10% off discount on all orders currently. I know the product is new and will take time to become established.

Llayden said:
I am also concerned with the one size offered. It's all circumstantial, but it all sort of leads me to the same conclusion others have made that a bulk order to alibaba or China was made, and now someone has a container full of product they need to push.
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You're not wrong. I did purchase these in bulk from my supplier and now I have to sell them! :biggrin: I don't speak for my competitors, but this is commonly how ecommerce works (which you likely already know).

It seems like there is some concern as to why I only made size "medium" available from the start. A Reddit user asked a similar question, I'll quote my response:

BumoozaOfficial said:
[question regarding why only size "medium" is offered currently...]
And you are correct - financial limitations of starting a new product are what was holding me back from introducing a size "large" at the same time as size "medium". The production costs, shipping costs to our distribution center, and ongoing warehousing costs would have doubled the startup expenses of the business. The intention of course was not to discriminate against those who would be ordering a "large", but to make starting the company itself feasible. It sounds like you understand this, and I appreciate it!
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Decisions have to be made to strategically minimize risk when taking on a new venture like this. I will be the last person to claim I've done things perfectly. However, I've got to work within the bounds of my own limitations, financial and otherwise.

Llayden said:
However, this may just be due to a slightly premature release of information? I'm hoping that this is legitimate
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I'm unclear of your concern on this part.

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relaedataris said:
To add to your thought - seeing as it has custom printing, it's considered OEM. In order to source an OEM order, the manufacture has special requirements as they need to keep their operations optimized. IE: machines running, labor, etc. For example, they may require a 20ft cargo container worth of inventory per size, as that allotment would mean machine and workers are running a full day. Unless you have a strong relationship with the company, they may not be willing to say 1/2 can be mediums, and the other 1/2 of the container can be large due to machines being down during alterations needed to manufacture the other size. If the new company only has enough capital to purchase the 20ft container, they'll release a one size fits most approach.. then after selling through the initial inventory, they may have the required capital for a 40ft shipping container worth of inventory that can be multiple sizes.
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You're spot on reladataris.

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irnub said:
It's definitely not. The way they get the rating is to weigh the diaper, immerse it in water for several minutes, then weigh it again and take the difference. Even when taken with a massive grain of salt and understanding that it's a standardized test for all the diapers on the market, it still has some major flaws:

1) SAP is actually neutralized by salt, so that means that diapers will a high SAP content will be inaccurately rated as better compared to diapers with more wood pulp (or even diapers that do something fancy to counteract the salt).

2) past a certain point, the actual distribution of the fluff and the absorption properties of the specific mixture will have more of an effect than raw capacity. e.g. a diaper that holds less but aquires liquid quickly vs holding more but aquiring slower.

3) a bunch of other stuff I can't remember because it's 3am, but you probably get the point.

Diaper testing is actually a really fascinating subject, as the industry hasn't really improved on it in the last several decades since no one has really agreed on a standard. iirc there's some really good resources on adisc with an attempt at standardizing some more more realistic and repeatable diaper testing methods.
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Nice! This is really insightful. I appreciate your input on this.


-Guy
 
Let's talk about quality. Define form me what you mean by quality? Is it a measure whereby all of the product has four tapes, and has the specified amount of sap/pulp/filling?

From a customer point of view, to me, quality would mean tapes adhering properly, leg gather elastics firmly grounded, sap/filling encased by appropriate amounts of material, which all lead to increased reliability of the product.

When I see tapes bonded to the backing sheet by 10mm of tape material, how reliable are those tapes going to hold to that backing sheet under expected normal usage?

Also, when I see adverts saying 5000ml, I call bullshit to that claim. 5000ml of water equals 5kg of weight, suspended by two to four tapes anchored by 10mm of material to the backing sheet. It ain't gonna happen. The whole design will fail before one gets anywhere near 5000ml of wetting. Which is false advertising.

Differentiate your product by conducting real world product testing, and advertise as such.

Also, define "realistic" for me please? You want a pure baby-like product, or a diaper that works like a diaper should? Are you looking to mimic an old-school product, or one that would look as good on a baby as an adult baby?
 
Way to go, it takes guts to research and then invest all that capital! I actually like the simplicity of the design, not overly crowded or gaudy looking. I would however, look at resizing the design and make sure the spacing is better for the next run. Personally I want a design kinda like the monkey (purple) design on the luvs diapers, simple with pastel/lighter shade colors. The Abu kiddo diapers do a minimalist design well too. Too many "loud" designs out there!
 
ozziebee said:
Let's talk about quality. Define form me what you mean by quality? Is it a measure whereby all of the product has four tapes, and has the specified amount of sap/pulp/filling?

From a customer point of view, to me, quality would mean tapes adhering properly, leg gather elastics firmly grounded, sap/filling encased by appropriate amounts of material, which all lead to increased reliability of the product.

When I see tapes bonded to the backing sheet by 10mm of tape material, how reliable are those tapes going to hold to that backing sheet under expected normal usage?

Also, when I see adverts saying 5000ml, I call bullshit to that claim. 5000ml of water equals 5kg of weight, suspended by two to four tapes anchored by 10mm of material to the backing sheet. It ain't gonna happen. The whole design will fail before one gets anywhere near 5000ml of wetting. Which is false advertising.

Differentiate your product by conducting real world product testing, and advertise as such.

Also, define "realistic" for me please? You want a pure baby-like product, or a diaper that works like a diaper should? Are you looking to mimic an old-school product, or one that would look as good on a baby as an adult baby?
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I still wish to know this information as well. When I asked I was given the same blanket statements of "year long project", "do it right", "quality is king". I would really like to hear some specifics on the product, and what exactly sets it apart from the competition. If it's only difference is the appearance, but the product is on par with the competition, there is nothing wrong with that at all...but I'd like to know.

To further clarify my position BumoozaOfficial, it is NOT one of skepticism. To be skeptical I would have to have some information in regards to the product that I am unsure or without firsthand knowledge. Since there is NO information provided about the product, why it's "superior quality", or what sets it apart from the competition I cannot be skeptical. I am simply in the dark and wish to know more about your product.

And if you honestly feel that purchasing/delivery systems aren't necessarily in need of revision or could be a selling point, you are dead wrong. ABU is a great example of this; one of their best selling points when the company was revamped was the purchasing and delivery system. You can't order product that didn't exist, customers can easily see what's available, and the shipping rates were easy to understand. In fact, I'd wager that a good 20% or more of your customers have legitimate shipping concerns. A cursory search for "shipping" on this site should prove that very quickly.

Also using ABU as an example, when they were rebuilding and changing their product they were exceptionally clear an upfront as to the changes being made. They always let you know what kind of materials are going into the product (tapes are a giant issues in this industry) and let you know what was going on in the design, production, and shipping process. Other companies have absolutely followed suit, the biggest names are all just as transparent.
 
Llayden said:
And if you honestly feel that purchasing/delivery systems aren't necessarily in need of revision or could be a selling point, you are dead wrong. ABU is a great example of this; one of their best selling points when the company was revamped was the purchasing and delivery system. You can't order product that didn't exist, customers can easily see what's available, and the shipping rates were easy to understand. In fact, I'd wager that a good 20% or more of your customers have legitimate shipping concerns. A cursory search for "shipping" on this site should prove that very quickly.
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I hear you my friend. Have you checked out the shipping page? If you have any suggestions for anything additional you'd like to see there, please let me know. A lot of these concerns are addressed.

Llayden said:
To further clarify my position BumoozaOfficial, it is NOT one of skepticism. To be skeptical I would have to have some information in regards to the product that I am unsure or without firsthand knowledge. Since there is NO information provided about the product, why it's "superior quality", or what sets it apart from the competition I cannot be skeptical. I am simply in the dark and wish to know more about your product.
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I don't think that's accurate to say. The details provided on my product page, from what I can see, are in line with what competitors typically provide.

Here's my stance: I am offering what I believe to be a high end diaper with a new design that will compete with other brand's high end diapers that are spec'd and marketed similarly. If the product is not for you, no worries. Hopefully a future iteration will be more appealing to you.



Llayden said:
Also using ABU as an example, when they were rebuilding and changing their product they were exceptionally clear an upfront as to the changes being made. They always let you know what kind of materials are going into the product (tapes are a giant issues in this industry) and let you know what was going on in the design, production, and shipping process.
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I think this is a fantastic approach. I intend to do the same thing.

What kind of Jeep is in your avatar? Automatic? Manual? It looks pretty cool. I've always wanted to purchase an SUV, but city driving can really rack up the gas bill.

- Guy
 
NeverKnow said:
I think the industry standard for measuring absorbency makes a lot of sense. There are obvious and insuperable problems with listing 'real world' absorbency rates. Diapers do not fit everyone the same way; it will look a lot more like a guarantee when nothing can be guaranteed here; the numbers would be meaningless if only one company performed 'real world' tests, and if multiple companies did, they would only be meaningful if the methodology were applied identically--but even if it were applied identically in each case, it would only tell you a fraction of the story about diapers' absorbency. Etc., etc. It is much more sensible just to list the absorbency of the materials used to make the diaper and let the qualitative stuff be handled as it has to be handled. In the end people have to test diapers for themselves and see which products work for them, and then products can get a reputation in the community.

The only changes that I think we should see are that a) companies should explain what the number means so that people who are unfamiliar with the premium diaper market know what they're looking at and b) that companies should state whether the absorbency is saline or not. (ABU, for instance, tests with a saline solution.)

Edit: Well, also: c) that companies just test using a saline solution.
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I couldn't have said it better. Product page updated.
 
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