Reducing the "Cringe" Mentality

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Theres 2 sides to this issue, one is if you are doing things that make people uncomfortable (such as flaunting the baby factor or forcing people to be exposed to things such as bad smells) then why shouldn't people feel uncomfortable?

On the other hand people need to be respectful that people wear diapers often for one need or another and if they aren't making a big deal out then others shouldn't be either.
 
ZetaSonic said:
Stuff like this is WHY I want more of us to become more open about it.
It's why I want activism to be done.

There is very good reason why not many are willing to do so. One, we know it doesn't have to be public. Two, getting it to a point of acceptance that some of you are hoping for is a pipe dream. Three, you are not thinking about all the negative aspects that would occur by having more people become activists for being AB/DL and shining a light on AB/DL as a whole. It's time to take off the rose tinted glasses.

Edit: I am honestly, not even sure what you are expecting out of it. Do you think it's going to stop the cringe some people have? It won't.
There is plenty of activism for transgender issues and as of recent it's gotten worse, not better. Do you know how often people make the joke about being an attack helicopter now and make fun of the situation? That occurred because we had the wrong kind of activism.

You have to realize, you will also be having AB/DL out in the open who you may not agree with, and who may have a bigger voice than you.
 
MarchinBunny said:
Urine is human waste, so that is included and it's certainly not the minority who use diapers in the AB/DL community.
Good job moving the goalposts. Nevertheless, the fact remains that messing is far more uncommon than those who speak negatively of diapers imagine. Even among those who need them, bowel incontinence is far more rare than urinary incontinence, making it clear that those who are conditioned into primarily associating diapers with shit are simply conditioned into doing so and don't actually know what they're talking about.

That is what they were invented for and that is what they are used for. It IS common sense that is what people would see them for. The amount who simply wear them without using them is by far the minority.
At the end of the day, they all wear them, so the amount of people who wear them is definitely the majority.

Diapers = human waste.
Nope, they're a kind of underwear, actually. Now that's common sense.

I do know what those are ... yes, but not the same thing as not everyone has skid marks because a lot of people actually know how to wipe their ass properly.
And not everyone goes in their diapers. Fact remains, the purpose of all underwear is to protect from things like that staining outer clothes.

Not the same thing
It kind of is the exact same thing, in as literal of a sense as it gets. They're both clothes you wear tightly and directly wrapped to your crotch. The fetishes form for the exact same reasons.

and you are never going to convince anyone it's the same. If you think I'm so wrong .. then prove me wrong and I DARE you to go outside and start talking to people about. Let's see how wrong I am ... shall we? If you are so convinced I'm wrong .. then do it. Stop being all talk ... and show me I'm wrong. I am betting though you wouldn't because you know dang well I'm correct on this matter. But ya, the whole world is ignorant on diaper use, except you.
You sound a bit upset. By the way, I would advise you not to throw stones in glass houses.

Diapers are designed for human waste.
Yup, just like boxers, briefs, panties and thongs. And just like them, they're also designed for comfort and sexual appeal.
 
Springcircle said:
Good job moving the goalposts.
I didn't, I been saying human waste from the start, and that includes urine. You are the one who set the goalpost in a spot I did not.

Nevertheless, the fact remains that messing is far more uncommon than those who speak negatively of diapers imagine. Even among those who need them, bowel incontinence is far more rare than urinary incontinence, making it clear that those who are conditioned into primarily associating diapers with shit are simply conditioned into doing so and don't actually know what they're talking about.
I don't think people are conditioned to think "shit" specifically when they think of diapers. I said they think of human waste. Again, because that is what they are invented for. It seems quite natural that is what they would think about. Pee and poop. It's also important to note, most people see urine as pretty gross as well. XD


At the end of the day, they all wear them, so the amount of people who wear them is definitely the majority.
Of course the majority who wear diapers, wear them. Exactly what you are trying to say here? o_O
The majority who wear them use them. While the minority who wear them don't use them. But of course, they all wear them. That is stating the obvious.

Nope, they're a kind of underwear, actually. Now that's common sense.
They are a kind of underwear. But their purpose is for human waste. Not just minor soiling from wear.

And not everyone goes in their diapers. Fact remains, the purpose of all underwear is to protect from things like that staining outer clothes.
Yes, and only diapers are specifically meant for capturing a large quantity of human waste. It's not like everyone just typically leaks and fills their underwear with a load like what diapers are used for. And only a very small minority do not use their diapers.

It kind of is the exact same thing, in as literal of a sense as it gets. They're both clothes you wear tightly and directly wrapped to your crotch. The fetishes form for the exact same reasons.
It's not the exact same thing at all. Besides it being something you wear, the purpose of each couldn't be more different.

You sound a bit upset. By the way, I would advise you not to throw stones in glass houses.
Not upset at all. Having a debate and disagreeing with someone doesn't equal upset.

Yup, just like boxers, briefs, panties and thongs. And just like them, they're also designed for comfort and sexual appeal.
They are not for the same quantity of human waste. We are talking about significantly different purposes. If it's meant for the same thing, wear a regular pair of underwear and wet yourself. Let's see how well that works for you. XD
 
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I agree with Marchinbunny.

When you think diapers you think of babies and incontinent older people. Even though they're people in the community that do not use their diapers (in the sense of wetting or messing) people's intial reaction of somebody wearing a diaper is that they are using the diaper.

The disposable diaper was developed by NASA because they discovered astronauts were wetting theirselves due to the pressure induced through space travel.

No matter what you make as an argument, most people's first assumption of diapers will be that they are used. You may be able to convince them otherwise or at the very least change their view to be less negative towards it, but it's a natural reaction to think that's what they are for.

As for trying to prevent people from cringing about it. You will always have those people.

The biggest fear for most people outside of the community in reaction to discovering somebody is wearing diapers (and not for medical purposes) appears to be an assumption that that person is a pediphile. Maybe efforts should made to educate people in that area.

If anything else is done to try to bring light to the ABDL community, it should be to acknowledge that there is a support community for it for anybody who is a AB/ DL/ IC living in fear of an outcast, freak, etc.
 
Slomo said:
Right, did you miss a few hundred posts or something? I've debated this point in extreme detail. Now yeah, when this topic gets to point I'm just repeating what I've already said, then why would I continue to reply.

And if someone has ANY fetish I would NOT want to hear about it al all. And as we already know, all fetishes are sexual. A person's sexual activities do not belong anywhere other than behind a bedroom door.

Not all fetishes are sexual. . . I mean it really is people like you who say that all fetishes are sexual that are the reason AB/DL has a negative image. Sorry not sorry. AB/DL can be a fetish. For some people it is sexual. No that doesn't mean its pedophilia. Just because its a fetish doesn't mean its sexual.


You as part of the AB/DL Community saying that "All Fetishes are sexual" are part of the problem. I mean I don't know how hard it is to understand that you are part of the problem with the negative view on it. If you, someone who has to have some sort of ab/dl fetish for being on the site, turn around and say its not a fetish. You're in denial. Get over yourself. You are not holier than thou.

Edit*: Maybe you think all fetishes are sexual because all of YOUR Fetishes are sexual? Just because you think that doesn't mean it's the truth.
 
Springcircle said:
Good job moving the goalposts. Nevertheless, the fact remains that messing is far more uncommon than those who speak negatively of diapers imagine. Even among those who need them, bowel incontinence is far more rare than urinary incontinence, making it clear that those who are conditioned into primarily associating diapers with shit are simply conditioned into doing so and don't actually know what they're talking about.


At the end of the day, they all wear them, so the amount of people who wear them is definitely the majority.


Nope, they're a kind of underwear, actually. Now that's common sense.


And not everyone goes in their diapers. Fact remains, the purpose of all underwear is to protect from things like that staining outer clothes.


It kind of is the exact same thing, in as literal of a sense as it gets. They're both clothes you wear tightly and directly wrapped to your crotch. The fetishes form for the exact same reasons.


You sound a bit upset. By the way, I would advise you not to throw stones in glass houses.


Yup, just like boxers, briefs, panties and thongs. And just like them, they're also designed for comfort and sexual appeal.
Hey, I agree with you. I get both sides of the story but I'm more open minded than other people. This world isn't perfect but we all find things that are comfortable. Whether it's lying on a pillow or wearing a diaper. At the end of the day, what's it matter? We are who we are and should be proud of it. If you tend to your business only then what's it matter if someone happens to point out they do something that's not regular of society. Just remember, just like the person your talking to, isn't so open minded. If they want to refuse to at least attempt and realize that there are different people out in the world, then so be it. You've already won. 😁

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BabyMax2000 said:
Hey, I agree with you. I get both sides of the story but I'm more open minded than other people. This world isn't perfect but we all find things that are comfortable. Whether it's lying on a pillow or wearing a diaper. At the end of the day, what's it matter? We are who we are and should be proud of it. If you tend to your business only then what's it matter if someone happens to point out they do something that's not regular of society. Just remember, just like the person your talking to, isn't so open minded. If they want to refuse to at least attempt and realize that there are different people out in the world, then so be it. You've already won. ��

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What are you talking about? o_O Are you insinuating I am not open minded x.x? How did you figure that?
 
Sorry, I'm still trying to figure this forum out on who I'm replying too. What I said was, I'm agreeing with you. And I never said you weren't open minded. For me, I tend to more open minded on things. Such as the abdl community, i didn't see any harm in that. If anything sounds interesting I give a look at it and maybe try it. I live in the bible belt so that's what I meant about being more open minded. Alot of people in my area arent.

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well cringe would occur less if more people were desensitized to the concept of AB/DL as far as I can see.
 
Mikeythevulpix said:
well cringe would occur less if more people were desensitized to the concept of AB/DL as far as I can see.
So true. And learned more about the community as well.

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MarchinBunny said:
I didn't, I been saying human waste from the start, and that includes urine. You are the one who set the goalpost in a spot I did not.


I don't think people are conditioned to think "shit" specifically when they think of diapers. I said they think of human waste. Again, because that is what they are invented for. It seems quite natural that is what they would think about. Pee and poop. It's also important to note, most people see urine as pretty gross as well. XD
There's a pretty major difference between how disgusting pee and poop are, though, and those who react negatively to diapers tend to gravitate towards assuming the latter. Either way, the fact that the association is a conditioned response remains.

Of course the majority who wear diapers, wear them. Exactly what you are trying to say here? o_O
The majority who wear them use them. While the minority who wear them don't use them. But of course, they all wear them. That is stating the obvious.
And hence, it's obvious that their main function is to be worn, and not just "human waste".

They are a kind of underwear. But their purpose is for human waste. Not just minor soiling from wear. Yes, and only diapers are specifically meant for capturing a large quantity of human waste. It's not like everyone just typically leaks and fills their underwear with a load like what diapers are used for. And only a very small minority do not use their diapers.
Human waste is human waste, as you yourself say, so there's no real difference. There's nothing saying someone who wears a diaper has to put it to full use, either. In fact, most mainstream adult diaper brands nowadays cater to minor leakage.

It's not the exact same thing at all. Besides it being something you wear, the purpose of each couldn't be more different.
It is something you wear, hence it obviously is the same thing. And yes, the purpose is pretty much the same, just different in scale.

Not upset at all. Having a debate and disagreeing with someone doesn't equal upset.
Screeching about how totally nobody would be convinced kind of comes across as pretty upset and desperate to force your viewpoint, actually. By the way, reasonable people do get convinced, thank you very much.

They are not for the same quantity of human waste. We are talking about significantly different purposes. If it's meant for the same thing, wear a regular pair of underwear and wet yourself. Let's see how well that works for you.
Probably about as well as doing it in Depends. The stigma in wearing that brand is there all the same, making it clear as day that no, people don't dislike diapers because of "human waste", but because they're conditioned into doing so.
 
Mikeythevulpix said:
well cringe would occur less if more people were desensitized to the concept of AB/DL as far as I can see.

Yes, you could reduce cringe if you did that for anything really, but probably only to a certain amount. The other issue is the feasibility of actually doing it and is it worth trying? I also think there always will be things that make people cringe no matter how much you try to desensitize it.

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Springcircle said:
There's a pretty major difference between how disgusting pee and poop are, though, and those who react negatively to diapers tend to gravitate towards assuming the latter. Either way, the fact that the association is a conditioned response remains.
It's not a conditioned response because it's a response based around a natural aversion. The diapers end up having an aversion too simply because they are associated with that natural aversion to human waste. Nothing is going to change that. It's the same reason eating off a toilet just sounds terrible to people. It's why the toilet itself just seems so dirty no matter how much you clean it.
The water in the bowl might be perfectly clean and drinkable, but I bet you wouldn't find many people to actually drink from it, because of that association with our natural aversion to human waste.

And hence, it's obvious that their main function is to be worn, and not just "human waste".
Their main function isn't just to be worn though. It's main function is to absorb and contain human waste. The wearing part is simply the way it's done, not it's purpose.

Human waste is human waste, as you yourself say, so there's no real difference. There's nothing saying someone who wears a diaper has to put it to full use, either. In fact, most mainstream adult diaper brands nowadays cater to minor leakage.
And? o.o There is a pretty big difference, as plain underwear don't even take in minor leaks like that. Maybe a dribble at most lol. Don't ask me why, I am not a psychologist, but people are more willing to put up with a dribble than they are to put up with more than that. That is just how people are.

To you there might not be much of a difference, but to the majority of the world, I am betting you, while some people may like to smell underwear ... they would never smell a diaper even if it was on the same women the underwear was on.


It is something you wear, hence it obviously is the same thing. And yes, the purpose is pretty much the same, just different in scale.
It's something you wear, hence it's obviously the same thing? So ... to you a condome is the same as a hat? A hat is the same as pad for women. Interesting concept you got there. I am curious to see how you dress. XD

That difference is scale is a huge difference lol.

Screeching about how totally nobody would be convinced kind of comes across as pretty upset and desperate to force your viewpoint, actually. By the way, reasonable people do get convinced, thank you very much.
XD Reasonable people get convinced when the person doing the convincing is actually convincing, of which you are not.

Probably about as well as doing it in Depends.
I do admit depends is pretty bad, but not that bad lol.

The stigma in wearing that brand is there all the same, making it clear as day that no, people don't dislike diapers because of "human waste", but because they're conditioned into doing so.
The stigma in wearing that brand is due to it just being popular and it being a terrible brand has to do with their qualitiy. you are pointing to things that are irrelvant and are fallacies.
 
MarchinBunny said:
It's not a conditioned response because it's a response based around a natural aversion. The diapers end up having an aversion too simply because they are associated with that natural aversion to human waste. Nothing is going to change that.
Wrong, since that association is nothing but a conditioned response. All that needs to be done to change it is to make society acknowledge how harmful and ignorant certain mantras regarding diapers are.

Their main function isn't just to be worn though. It's main function is to absorb and contain human waste. The wearing part is simply the way it's done, not it's purpose.
And as we've already established, all kinds of underwear are like that.

To you there might not be much of a difference, but to the majority of the world, I am betting you, while some people may like to smell underwear ... they would never smell a diaper even if it was on the same women the underwear was on.
Yeah, because they're conditioned to have an irrational aversion towards them. Nice appeal to majority fallacy, by the way.

It's something you wear, hence it's obviously the same thing? So ... to you a condome is the same as a hat? A hat is the same as pad for women. Interesting concept you got there. I am curious to see how you dress. XD
The obvious connection is that they're both underwear. You failing to catch that speaks volumes about you.

XD Reasonable people get convinced when the person doing the convincing is actually convincing, of which you are not.
You failing to be convinced doesn't mean it's not convincing to others.

you are pointing to things that are irrelvant and are fallacies.
Actually, I've just been stating the facts. You, on the other hand, have been nothing but intellectually dishonest and appealing to the majority. You can say that people disagree all you want, but an opinion grounded in facts always beats one grounded in public perception.
 
Springcircle said:
Ehh, I give up. Doesn't seem like you are going to be the least bit reasonable. So don't see any reason to continue. XD
It's tough when we can't even agree there is a difference between diapers and regular underwear.
 
rennecfox said:
Theres 2 sides to this issue, one is if you are doing things that make people uncomfortable (such as flaunting the baby factor or forcing people to be exposed to things such as bad smells) then why shouldn't people feel uncomfortable?

On the other hand people need to be respectful that people wear diapers often for one need or another and if they aren't making a big deal out then others shouldn't be either.

That's exactly the same mindset that I have concerning diapers. :D
 
I think there's a huge difference between squick and kink shaming that a lot of people seem to miss.

A squick is just a knee-jerk sense of disgust towards something, whereas kink shaming is actively shaming someone for having a kink, thinking they're wrong, defective, terrible, etc.

If by reducing cringe, you mean get rid of the squick factor, then Sorry. But that's not going to happen. As other people here have mentioned, the whole connection diapers have to pee and poop is going to cause a lot of people to be squicked out. And that's not even a bad thing per se. People have their squicks. Everyone is grossed out by some sort of kinks. I can certainly tell you plenty of other kinks and fetishes that squick me out. Now I'm not going to kink shame these people and say "The people who like Roman Showers need therapy!" or "Fuck those who like needles!", but both of those things are squicks for me, and diapers and ABDL are a squick for a lot of other people.

Now if you want to reduce kink shaming, I hear you. I want to reduce that too. But I don't think an ABDL advocacy movement is going to achieve that goal. First off, we don't need a movement since fortunately, we have all our rights right now. Second of all, I honestly think that a huge reason there isn't more hate for ABDLs isn't because people are simply open minded and tolerant towards ABDLs, but rather simply because they don't know that we exist, and such a movement would sadly make things much worse for ABDLs.

Honestly, I think the best thing you can do to reduce kink shaming is to simply spread the idea of being open minded, allowing people to do what they want as long as they aren't hurting anyone (Live and let live), and not being an asshole. If people are open minded, believe in live and let live, and aren't assholes, then they probably won't kink shame. They might be squicked out and have an initial feeling of disgust and not want to hear about it, but they probably won't unfriend you or hate you for it as long as you aren't shoving it in their face and treating it as you would treat any other vanilla sexual activity. As long as you hang around decent open-minded people, you should be fine, and hopefully, more people adopt this mindset, as I totally support a "Be open minded, Don't be an asshole" movement.
 
MarchinBunny said:
Ehh, I give up. Doesn't seem like you are going to be the least bit reasonable. So don't see any reason to continue. XD
It's tough when we can't even agree there is a difference between diapers and regular underwear.

Well, considering diapers are pretty undeniably a kind of underwear what with how they're something one wears under one's outer clothes, I definitely agree you should give up if you can't even recognize that much. Quite obvious the one being unreasonable is you, considering you're seriously trying to peddle ignorant misconceptions about our community on an AB/DL site.
 
Gsmax said:
As long as you hang around decent open-minded people, you should be fine, and hopefully, more people adopt this mindset, as I totally support a "Be open minded, Don't be an asshole" movement.

This.

I think ''Don't be an asshole'' is something that should be applied to just everyday life as well, not just kinks and sexual activity. Basically... they're words to live by.

bible-617x426.jpg
 
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