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Thread: Nazi/racist friend, what to do

  1. #1

    Default Nazi/racist friend, what to do

    So I have been talking to someone online four four years now and I have accidentally discovered things about him during our chats over the years like he is racist because he acts like it's all okay and seems to justify it by showing me statistics and also he has told me about how bad Muslims are and trying to get me to be a Muslimophobic and tells me how much they are hated in Europe. Now I find out he is a holocaust denier and he seems to think Hitler is a great person. He has not told me directly he is these things but the fact he dodges my questions with general answers and doesn't tell me what he thinks himself about it tells me he is these things too since he won't give me a direct answer. It's either lie or dodge a question so it gives out your answer obviously when you dodge the question.

    Why do I talk to him? Because we had been talking for so long and two we always talk about my stories so that is the only reason why I keep talking to him than ignoring him and deleting our chat thread. I have thought about it several times doing it but then thinking I don't want to lose my chat buddy who loves my stories and I would have no one else to talk to about it.

    Then last night I finally blew it when he dodged my question again for one last time when I asked him if any of his schools denied the Holocaust and made Hitler out to be a great person despite what he did bad and he didn't tell me if his schools did that but instead told me in general what schools can teach what they think is the truth and how others must respect their opinion what they think is true. So finally I called him a racist and a Nazi and a bigot and how he stereotypes groups because he hadn't been answering my questions directly and if he were none of these things, he would have told me so but because he didn't I think these things of him and the fact he had not been answering my questions directly. I even told him that not answering my questions directly makes me think these things about him because it's either he lies or dodges them so it gives out the answer anyway or else he would have said he isn't either of these things.

    Now I have not been back to that forum since and I am too afraid of any confrontations and if he deletes our chat, fine by me. At least I will know it's over and it will still be sad I lost someone I could talk about my stories with but I don't like racists or Nazis or bigots and if I knew these things about him from the beginning, I would have quit talking to him before I got attached. But he sometimes gives me anxiety and I sometimes get upset with him and I sometimes feel like having meltdowns when he dodges my questions or ignores them so I got pissed and said those things to him. Now I am afraid to go back.

    What would you do in this situation? Would you quit talking to someone you had been friends with for a while if you had just found out they were racist or a Holocaust denier and thought Hitler was a good guy? Or would you stay with them and put up with it because you had been friends for too long so it wouldn't be worth throwing away a friendship over this?

  2. #2

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    I'd slowly fade out if something clashed with me that terribly. I wouldn't continue maintaining the friendship, but I wouldn't throw it away. I think if it's bothering you that much eventually you'll find that path being of least resistance anywho, but.. I don't like advising you to give up a friend, but I'm not sure what you can do unless you can talk to this person about those things that are bothering you and have him understand. Unfortunately it doesn't sound like that's the case?

    Best of luck with this sweetie. I have too many bias toward subjects like this, but my personal opinion being try and keep your distance. Even if only for a while, it can give you time to calm down, recollect and reapproach if you really want to at that time.

    I can tell you're hurting yourself a bit over this, be mindful of your needs and wants and don't worry so much about losing a connection here, there will be others for you to form. New chatting buddies, etc. But this one could keep you from those, especially if it's emotionally charging and you find yourself too invested.

  3. #3

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    Wow, that's a tricky situation. If I really felt like a friend to them, I think I would try my best to get them past such ridiculous ideas. Hitler originally wanted to be a painter... he should have just stuck to that. It doesn't make any logical sense to deny that the holocaust occurred, so, assuming your friend can handle logical reasoning, this should be a solvable problem. But it may take some time and some "hammering" to get the message through. But racism and anti-Semitism are pretty serious issues; you might want to nudge him into some sort of therapy to get past that.

    Also, like gigglebutt said, sometimes you just have to walk away. As a teen, I had an online friend once who I'd spoken to on the phone for several years, but one night he turned rather creepy. I called him with several things on my mind to discuss, and we got to none of them -- all he would talk about is when can I come visit, why can't I, he'll make sure his wife isn't around and we're all alone, what's the problem... etc. Oh, and he's had several other guests over who found him sexually attractive despite his being married, and he had them over when his wife was out-of-town. Red flag! I didn't call him again after that... nor did he call me again. Sometimes you just have to move on.

  4. #4

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    I know what you are saying, Sapphyre, about trying to help this friend, but ultimately I think your second is more likely to be the better choice. Consider the message that these people are spewing, one that goes so far against the grain of common decency and established historical record, and any consideration whatsoever for their fellow travelers on this planet. It is not a message one arrives at lightly. It is one that must, by its very nature, be the result of considerable imprinting. Believing we might be able to change such people is almost akin to the old adage about making a leopard change its spots.

    You've done the right thing by calling him out, Calico. The only mystery to me is how you managed to last so long after you started to suspect it. I doubt I'd have stayed in the conversation five minutes before confronting him and having it out, but then I have zero tolerance for stupidity, and that stuff is stupidity par excellence to me. I know you enjoyed the conversations; clearly on other matters he had interesting things to say. But there are certain belief systems that simply disqualify a person from being part of decent society.

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Calico View Post
    What would you do in this situation? Would you quit talking to someone you had been friends with for a while if you had just found out they were racist or a Holocaust denier and thought Hitler was a good guy? Or would you stay with them and put up with it because you had been friends for too long so it wouldn't be worth throwing away a friendship over this?
    That's a really tough question.

    Clearly you know he's talking nonsense, and (I assume!) you aren't going to be persuaded by his pro-Nazi views. So, there's no "risk" to you in talking with this person. And you aren't encouraging him in his bigoted views just by talking to him, so there's no risk to himself or others.

    If he spends a lot of time trying to convince you that he is right, then you just have to say, "Enough is enough! You're not going to convince me that you're right and I don't want to discuss this any more!"

    But... if he's "just" a friend who happens to be a neo-nazi... and no one's being harmed by your friendship, then... I wouldn't just throw away the friendship.

    Apparently Wagner was implicated with the Nazis, but that doesn't make his music any less amazing. Your friend might have abhorrent political views, but maybe he's also really interesting when talking about music... or whatever.

    Maybe your friend will come to realise that you aren't impressed with his views. Maybe he'll reconsider them, and your friendship will lead him to respect your opinions and realise that his own are foolish.

    I guess the most important thing is that you're honest with him and say that you don't share his views. If he cares about your friendship, he'll shut up about the things that you disagree on. If he just keeps going on and on about his Nazi views, then... he obviously cares about that more than he cares what you think... so in that case I'd ditch him!

  6. #6

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    If everyone who disagreed with Holocaust deniers, simply cut them from their lives, there would be no eye opening discussions between those of different views.
    sometimes its better to get a discussion going, even if its gradual over many years.


    (And keep in mind, this individual was obviously well aware of your feelings, or at least suspected, and was attempting to not bring this issue to the fore, thereby respecting your perceived beliefs?)

    as for him bringing up ideas that Muslims are unpopular in Europe, and as you said " trying to get me to be a Muslimophobic", that's not something you are obligated to put up with.

    You are obviously attached to this individual, and might also keep in mind, you are labeling him with YOUR words, I.E. Nazi, when this individual did not identify himself with that particular group. In fact it sounds like you hurled about every epithet within reach at him.

    I realize that it is extremely unfashionable to associate with people with these beliefs in today's society, but further ostracizing them, at least in my mind, is not going to change any hearts or bridge any gaps.


    I suggest approaching him, and explaining that you needed a cooling down period, after unleashing what it sounds like had really been building up for years.
    If he reacts with hostility, or its causing YOU undue stress, then I suggest you look to your own needs first, I.E. phasing him out of your life.

    I have not read any of your stories, but that is about to change now! maybe you will have someone new to talk about them with =)

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by kerry View Post
    I know what you are saying, Sapphyre, about trying to help this friend, but ultimately I think your second is more likely to be the better choice. Consider the message that these people are spewing, one that goes so far against the grain of common decency and established historical record, and any consideration whatsoever for their fellow travelers on this planet. It is not a message one arrives at lightly. It is one that must, by its very nature, be the result of considerable imprinting. Believing we might be able to change such people is almost akin to the old adage about making a leopard change its spots.
    I suppose it is a common fallacy to think you can change someone else. There's certainly no guarantee of that. But I will say that, if you're sufficiently invested, it is possible. I've changed several of my friends, deliberately, though to smaller degrees than this. One of my friends had a habit of calling things "gay" with a connotation of being "wrong or screwed up." He got a pretty stern lecture and stopped doing it. So, without knowing more about the person in question here, that might be worth a shot. But if it's so deeply ingrained that he can't change his mind anymore, then yes, it's time to walk away.

    EDIT: Addendum... another of my friends considered furries to be weird sex maniacs. She got a stern lecture too. And she understands the furry fandom a bit better now. It CAN happen, there's just no guarantee.

    Further EDIT: Since this seems to come up often enough, and is for me a kind of guiding light in how I interact with others, I'll share it again here: Pink Floyd - Keep Talking. "It doesn't have to be like this... all we need to do... is make sure... we keep talking."

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by MommyandMattling View Post
    If everyone who disagreed with Holocaust deniers, simply cut them from their lives, there would be no eye opening discussions between those of different views.
    sometimes its better to get a discussion going, even if its gradual over many years.
    Denying the Holocaust is not a "different view." It is a disturbing lie that denies a truth that has shaped the lives of generations of Jews and others. It is ugly and vile at its core. There is nothing "eye opening" that can be discovered from such people on this subject. There is no "discussion" worth having with them. I'm sorry: neo-Nazis, white Supremacists, Holocaust deniers, and their ilk fall into this category: if hell doesn't exist, the Powers That Be might just consider inventing it just for them.

    I place run of the mill racists, homophobes, etc. in a very different category. *These* are the people who might, over a long time, still be salvageable. If you love them otherwise, they might be worth your effort to try to get them to change. For them, change is hard but possible. For the ones I mentioned above, though, their belief system is way too much an entrenched part of who they are. Altering even the smallest part of it would be as impossible as asking an oak tree to produce pine cones.

  9. #9

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    Agree to disagree I would not talk about these subjects because it's upsetting on both sides keep it to your stories and things that you enjoy with him.
    We all have different viewpoints and I agree some of the stuff that is happening in Germany is true because of what happened in Germany and Sweden and now Canada that's not being reported in the Press.
    You don't bring some one that it's normal to think people not your race are substandard you can do as you like to them rape kill.
    There are no go zones in Sweden and Germany that those that were born there had to leave in there own country why .
    I think mabey you could search Google about the rapes , killings, stealing.
    It's no different then having a wild wolf guard sheep oh he will learn it's ok you will lose sheep .
    Learn the truth us older person's have lived a while we may understand things you do not.
    The middle East has been killing for thousands of years it seems all they do is war in the West we have out grown wanting war.
    But true peace every one has to want it not every one can over come the hating.
    There was a teacher in Germany that took in refugees one of them killed him.
    The teacher gave clothing food the the center to help them out.
    Most of us do not want that here do you want one of those things to happen to your loved ones.
    The laws are so strict in the middle East to keep them under control steal hand cut off beheading.
    There are reasons why it is that way.
    So you bring uneducated people that all they know is there tribal leaders tell them .
    Hate others with different belief systems they see our way of life weak mindedness.
    They are killing Christians left and right over there .
    We are peaceful.
    Take care
    Last edited by foxkits; 17-Feb-2017 at 19:31.

  10. #10

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    Indoctrination isn't something you can simply change; it's why I said consider stepping out for a time and really think if it's worth doing all of this, as it's fairly obvious already that it's not going to change. Religion, political beliefs to a lesser extent are all things you'll struggle to change views on. If it were so easy, the world would've been a much nicer place.

    Sometimes, you just have to walk away.. even if you come back later, at least you'll be calmer and of clear mind!

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