Is there a line in Pride?

[ild95370]

I let my 17 year old go to a local Pride parade with his cousin and his at the request of his aunts. Now I have never been to one myself, and I do fully support the Pride movement. I am also bisexual myself. I asked him and his cousin how it was and they both told me that there were a lot of people wearing leather dog masks and there were a lot of furries there.

Here is what is possibly my unpopular opinion, and I’m just wondering anybody else’s thoughts on this:

I feel like this display crossed a line in the Pride movement. Everybody should be proud of who they are, but it seems to me that some used this parade to outwardly display fetishism in a high-visibility public event. To me, this detracts from the purpose of celebrating an entire segment of our society which has historically, and still does struggle for equality. I feel that fetishes were expressed which are best kept in private, or adults-only consenting settings. Am I wrong here?

Please don’t ban me.

 

[Hemix]

I think fetishes are in the minds of people. Talking about furries, some people like them while others don't, but that's it.

The spirit of the pride march encourages getting out of the closet without worrying about what other people think, so as long as you don't get too explicit, I don't see the problem there.

In fact, society evolves as time passes by, so that's a tendency that affects events as well. I think that, if they didn't evolve, they would become boring and less vivid as time passes by.

 

[fleckothefennec]

I'm a furry and bisexual

I am inclined to agree with you, I feel the much deserved "pride" has been over shadowed by expositionion of sexual fetish at these events. I feel it takes away from the original intent and actually harms it to a certain degree as it creates further stereotypes.

 

[ShippoFox]

I don't really get it. It's not an office meeting. No one is running around nude. No one is being hurt. I don't see the big deal (other than people who will use it as an excuse to say mean things). I'm not even really super into those masks... Too unrealistic. sometimes I think the definition of fetish has gone off the rails. This is a fetish, that is a fetish, everything is a fetish....? Maybe video games are a fetish now, who knows! Can't someone just like something without others assuming it's some kind of sexual thing? And Honestly, it's no one's business, as long as you're reasonable.

 

[ShippoFox]

can't edit my post hours later....

I missed the part where you complained about furries. I had just woke up. So what if there were furries there...? Why is that such a bad thing? I don't have a fursuit, but they can be totally adorable! I am sure the furries were not doing rude things openly in public (I'm sure some do sometimes, but they should not) Do you propose mascots be banned too? They could be furries, you dunno. Do you want to ban furry conventions too? Should we ban anything that could be remotely considered sexual in any vague way? Let's ban dresses? Let's ban bodybuilding too? Let's ban.... Halloween costume parties....? Does this get the point across?

Why do you assume that furries are 100% absolutely, primarily sexual? It is not like that. For many people, the sexual aspect is secondary or not at all. It's slightly just like how diapers aren't always sexual.... except diapers are meant to be worn under clothes in public, so there is that difference. Even if it is sexual, it should not matter, as long as they aren't "performing" anything sexual in public. Fursuits are NOT explicit. There is nothing wrong with them.

Also, your 17 year old either knows more than you think... or people make fun of her for not knowing things. One or the other. At least, that's how it was for me back then. I got harassed without mercy for not knowing things at a much younger age than that. You can't fully live in a bubble because people WILL attack that bubble, in some way, at some point. People are often not nice

Let's quit the judgement. End it. It's ridiculous. It's cliche. It makes the world a garbage, boring, hateful place to be.

I don't know why i'm posting this. you can't change people's minds. I'm probably only starting an argument I want nothing to do with.... but at least I'm trying, I guess

 

[insideoutlier]

I'm bi and used to be fully in the community. But I'm just too conservative for that crowd, and that's not a political statement, I mean conservative in behavior and what I project to the world. I'm as 'weird' and 'peculiar' as anybody privately but I don't care to share everything. You won't find bumper stickers on my car, for example. I'd prefer everybody to act more reserved in public. Everything is so loose now I fear it will swing back the other direction too far. So my controversial comment is: I don't understand why everything under the sun is folded in with LGB. To me a lot of the groups don't necessarily face the same issue(s) as LGB(T) and I wonder how they got to the same party. Or maybe they just crash the parades for the lols.

 

[ild95370]

can't edit my post hours later....

I missed the part where you complained about furries. I had just woke up. So what if there were furries there...? Why is that such a bad thing? I don't have a fursuit, but they can be totally adorable! I am sure the furries were not doing rude things openly in public (I'm sure some do sometimes, but they should not) Do you propose mascots be banned too? They could be furries, you dunno. Do you want to ban furry conventions too? Should we ban anything that could be remotely considered sexual in any vague way? Let's ban dresses? Let's ban bodybuilding too? Let's ban.... Halloween costume parties....? Does this get the point across?

Why do you assume that furries are 100% absolutely, primarily sexual? It is not like that. For many people, the sexual aspect is secondary or not at all. It's slightly just like how diapers aren't always sexual.... except diapers are meant to be worn under clothes in public, so there is that difference. Even if it is sexual, it should not matter, as long as they aren't "performing" anything sexual in public. Fursuits are NOT explicit. There is nothing wrong with them.

Also, your 17 year old either knows more than you think... or people make fun of her for not knowing things. One or the other. At least, that's how it was for me back then. I got harassed without mercy for not knowing things at a much younger age than that. You can't fully live in a bubble because people WILL attack that bubble, in some way, at some point. People are often not nice

Let's quit the judgement. End it. It's ridiculous. It's cliche. It makes the world a garbage, boring, hateful place to be.

I don't know why i'm posting this. you can't change people's minds. I'm probably only starting an argument I want nothing to do with.... but at least I'm trying, I guess

Should I wear a diaper to a Pride parade? Not much different than going in any other fetish related attire.

It’s one thing to flaunt rainbows on everything you have. That is the international symbol of the LGBTQ community, and a way to outwardly display your pride in being who you are. Being LGBTQ or other is not a fetish. That is the point here.

 

[ShippoFox]

Should I wear a diaper to a Pride parade? Not much different than going in any other fetish related attire.

It’s one thing to flaunt rainbows on everything you have. That is the international symbol of the LGBTQ community, and a way to outwardly display your pride in being who you are. Being LGBTQ or other is not a fetish. That is the point here.

what? then let's band bodybuilding and dresses? maybe pickup trucks? what else can we ban that people might vaguely consider sexual?
Diapers are underwear. Totally different from a fursuit. But YES. Wear a diaper to a pride event if you want. It should be under clothes. There should be no problem with that, if you are considerate about it. OR are you being ableist? And fursuits are NOT what you apparently think they are. they arent some kind of sex suit or gimp suit. and who gives a crap what someone does with it in private? Why does it concern you? why do people think literally everything is their business?

Also, I never said LGBTQ was a fetish.

 

[ild95370]

what? then let's band bodybuilding and dresses? maybe pickup trucks? what else can we ban that people might vaguely consider sexual?
Diapers are underwear. Totally different from a fursuit. But YES. Wear a diaper to a pride event if you want. It should be under clothes. There should be no problem with that, if you are considerate about it. OR are you being ableist? And fursuits are NOT what you apparently think they are. they arent some kind of sex suit or gimp suit. and who gives a crap what someone does with it in private? Why does it concern you? why do people think literally everything is their business?

Also, I never said LGBTQ was a fetish.

Clearly you’re missing the point here. This is about how LGTBQ is represented in public.

Comparing a mascot to a furrie is an invalid argument. I don’t need to explain that one.

Publicly Wearing leather attire that is typically associated with bedroom activities it not a good way to open narrow minds as it is associated with sexual deviance.

My 17 year old son can handle seeing these things. He is nonjudgemental towards any segment of society as I have raised him to be that way.

The concern here is that these outward displays of perceived fetishism during an event like this do more harm for the cause than good.

I’m sure you will reply to this with more accusations towards me and my kid even though you know nothing about us, and that is fine. You are no different than an old judgmental racist with preconceived notions about people that you don’t know.

I see your point that these things are not purely sexual for everybody, but the fact is that they are perceived by a large segment of the population as being a sexual fetish. Putting it out there is such a way is a detriment to Pride.

I have made my point here. For your sake, try to opens your narrow mind and see more than one side of an argument.

 

[Rakvirsza]

So, I'd really have to see the actual outfits in question to make a definitive assessment on it. I wouldn't inherently consider fursuits to be inherently a fetish thing as there are from my understanding at least, non-fetish furries. Of course some people will think otherwise, there are a lot of bad assumptions about both furries and LGBTQ people out there, but I wouldn't consider someone dressed as an antromorphic animal to be hurting anyone. I'm sure there are of course fursuits that would be...less appropriate to wear to Pride or any other public event. hence I say I would have to see the actual outfits in question to make a definitive judgement.

I do understand where you're coming from on this, and I do agree there is a line on what should be worn to Pride, as it is a public event and as you've said does influence how we're seen by the broader public. But at the same time, I don't think it's in the spirit of Pride to tell people how to live their lives when they aren't actually hurting anyone. People have tried to sexualize LGBTQ subjects in order to paint them as something that shouldn't be portrayed publically, so I don't believe in trying to place those same kinds of assumptions on other groups either. To make my stance absolutely clear though, actual explicitly fetish things, as opposed to things that are often associated with a fetish being used in a non-sexualized way, I would absolutely consider inappropriate for Pride.

It's ultimately not something with an easy answer though, and I do see where you're coming from on this. I just generally don't believe in judging people for dressing and living life in a way that makes them happy unless they're causing actual harm.

 

[ild95370]

I see your point about needing to see the outfits in question, but I think your point about how some people will think otherwise directly addresses my concern. Many may just say “it doesn’t matter what others think”, but the reality here is that it does matter.

Society as a whole has made significant progress over the past few decades when it comes to LGBTQ, however there are still many who are still bigoted, and there are many who are probably on the fence. We do not help the community at all by outwardly displaying something that can be perceived as sexual deviancy at a public event geared towards acceptance or we risk pushing those on the fence over to the other side.

I am not judging the people here. To each their own. I am however judging their individual actions because of the 2nd and 3rd order effects that those actions may have on our community.

 

[Left]

Clearly you’re missing the point here. This is about how LGTBQ is represented in public.

Comparing a mascot to a furrie is an invalid argument. I don’t need to explain that one.

Publicly Wearing leather attire that is typically associated with bedroom activities it not a good way to open narrow minds as it is associated with sexual deviance.

My 17 year old son can handle seeing these things. He is nonjudgemental towards any segment of society as I have raised him to be that way.

The concern here is that these outward displays of perceived fetishism during an event like this do more harm for the cause than good.

I’m sure you will reply to this with more accusations towards me and my kid even though you know nothing about us, and that is fine. You are no different than an old judgmental racist with preconceived notions about people that you don’t know.

I see your point that these things are not purely sexual for everybody, but the fact is that they are perceived by a large segment of the population as being a sexual fetish. Putting it out there is such a way is a detriment to Pride.

I have made my point here. For your sake, try to opens your narrow mind and see more than one side of an argument.

 

[LittleBabyJake]

Should I wear a diaper to a Pride parade? Not much different than going in any other fetish related attire.

It’s one thing to flaunt rainbows on everything you have. That is the international symbol of the LGBTQ community, and a way to outwardly display your pride in being who you are. Being LGBTQ or other is not a fetish. That is the point here.

There are some here in the Netherlands that wear openly during pride. I've also seen some AB's wear to some large LGBTQ+ festivals here. Especially during pride I might say it will have a spot. I don't share the same opinion at all. Here in the Netherlands the Pride is a huge party! It is one melting pot of people accepting each other and welcoming everyone who wants to be a part of it. My experience has always been exactly this and I suppose that's why it has been pushed so hard. People are seeking to get to a spot in the LGBTQ+ community and we will have everyone who wants to be a part of this.

Do take mind that leather/kink played a huge part in the movement. It used to be that you could not communicate your preference openly. This was often met with violence. The hanky/bandana code was a way for gay people to signal their preference. That said, I think that's why there is such a wide display on the parade these days. It's a way to openly express their preference.

I'd say the more the merrier. Who am I to judge or exclude?

Furthermore. I don't think that a piece of clothing, be it a diaper, fursuit, leathersuit, doggy mask, sissy dress or our fierce fighting warrior drag queens are offending anybody. I think it is even important to keep this momentum going. Nothing is off the chart as long as it is done with the loving spirit of our pride.

 

[Left]

Wearing Leather attire what is next, sex with ducks!?

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[Saltedcaramel64]

I see your point about needing to see the outfits in question, but I think your point about how some people will think otherwise directly addresses my concern. Many may just say “it doesn’t matter what others think”, but the reality here is that it does matter.

Society as a whole has made significant progress over the past few decades when it comes to LGBTQ, however there are still many who are still bigoted, and there are many who are probably on the fence. We do not help the community at all by outwardly displaying something that can be perceived as sexual deviancy at a public event geared towards acceptance or we risk pushing those on the fence over to the other side.

I am not judging the people here. To each their own. I am however judging their individual actions because of the 2nd and 3rd order effects that those actions may have on our community.

I used to be supportive of pride marches untill I saw what goes on at them. I feel uncomfortable at strip clubs and sex bars and the pride march appears to be the same as those. I would never dress like that or act like that in public with my wife or previous girl friends. I find it to be disrespectful to others. The behavior at pride has made me switch my position. Ill never support such public sexual behavior, hetero or homo. For some people pride has evolved into arrogance.

 

[LittleBabyJake]

I used to be supportive of pride marches untill I saw what goes on at them. I feel uncomfortable at strip clubs and sex bars and the pride march appears to be the same as those.

What did you see that made you think like this? Strip clubs and sex bars do not have anything to do with the pride march though. I'm talking about someone in a onesie on one of the pride boats giving a good show and party.

I would never dress like that or act like that in public with my wife or previous girl friends. I find it to be disrespectful to others. The behavior at pride has made me switch my position. Ill never support such public sexual behavior, hetero or homo. For some people pride has evolved into arrogance.

That is a personal opinion of course. One I share as well. I don't find it disrespectful to others on a pride march though. You are going to see things you don't like in life. That doesn't mean it is inheritly disrespectful. Why is it disrespectful? That's a genuine question. Also, i've not seen any sexual behaviour at a pride march. Marches are regulated by police because of the size of the event. They uphold law. You can not just show up naked or something. So, I'm having a hard time understanding what you are getting at.

 

[lilbabyjooce]

I think the argument for kink in pride is that pride is ultimately about sexuality, and beyond just the LGBTQ+ aspect, kink and fetishism is a part of sexuality as well.
Even with the basis being sexuality though, it’s not like pride is a giant fuck-fest where everyone is being openly sexually inappropriate. Generalizing pride as something similar to a strip club or something of the like is eerily similar to the idea that LGBTQ people are sexual deviants which was used against the community in the past. That being said, pride was never intended to be appealing to the masses anyways. Pride started as a protest. It was meant to be an in your face statement. I do find people demanding it to be palatable to everyone nowadays is kind of ironic when you look into it’s history.
Personally, I wouldn’t want to go to pride in my ABDL clothes or diapers or with any of my accessories. I am just a private person in general to the point where I am not “out” with my sexuality to most people (if they ask, I’ll tell them, but ultimately I don’t want to share or wear pins or hang up a flag or anything but that’s my personal preference). Also ABDL is still very taboo. The fact that people lose their minds over seeing a piece of leather gear at pride makes it clear that people are definitely not ready to see ABDL at pride, not to mention we are still given a negative connotation even in the kink community due to a lack of understanding.
I still don’t entirely know where I stand with kink in pride. I think especially given the history it has opened up my eyes a lot. The ABDL community is still pretty divided about publicly wearing/using in general so I think that adds to the feelings those of us have towards this topic.

 

[LittleBabyJake]

Personally, I wouldn’t want to go to pride in my ABDL clothes or diapers or with any of my accessories. I am just a private person in general to the point where I am not “out” with my sexuality to most people (if they ask, I’ll tell them, but ultimately I don’t want to share or wear pins or hang up a flag or anything but that’s my personal preference).

Sure. I stand the same on that. I'm too much of chicken to even dare to do something like that. Even if I dared I wouldn't because I think it's a very private thing. There are others though who would push that envelope. I'd say power to them.

Also ABDL is still very taboo. The fact that people lose their minds over seeing a piece of leather gear at pride makes it clear that people are definitely not ready to see ABDL at pride, not to mention we are still given a negative connotation even in the kink community due to a lack of understanding.
I still don’t entirely know where I stand with kink in pride. I think especially given the history it has opened up my eyes a lot. The ABDL community is still pretty divided about publicly wearing/using in general so I think that adds to the feelings those of us have towards this topic.

I fully agree with that. Also, outside of pride march I woudn't really either. It's just that I find this particular event the most suitable event to do this, if even at all. You did really put that together very well.