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Thread: Honoring heroes. Does it have to be like this..

  1. #1

    Default Honoring heroes. Does it have to be like this..

    Indonesia, Singapore in row over name of Navy ship | The Jakarta Post

    So Republic of Singapore is protesting the name of new Indonesian warship because the two heroes that is honored because they organize a bombing in Singapore during the 60s. Yes it is recognized as an act of terrorism although the two countries were at war back then. In the end the Singaporeans catch them and execute both of them.

    So what I have in mind is that. Each country has their own heroes and enemies. And like it or not each country will embraced them. I see what Singaporeans argued that it could make family of the victims mourned about it. But this is not new. I mean RAF of United Kingdom is naming one of their squadron 617 which is famous (of infamous depending on which side you are) for blowing up dam in Germany during WWII. And they still like to celebrate it recently last year during 60th anniversary reaches it's peak. But remember 1.600 people were killed. And if I were German watching their 60th anniversary (Including a pass by in the rebuild dam) it's quite offending. And this is not new either. German Navy once have the same problem in the 70s when naming their new ship after WW2 Heroes (Albeit that the name they were choose is German WW2 commanders that is known for their act of kindness to allies like Erwin Rommel)

    So what do you think of it? I personally believe that it is freedom of a democratic country to naming their heroes. And I believe the phrase "One man's heroes is another man's enemies"

  2. #2

    Default

    They are warships after all. It would seem a little silly to name a guided missile frigate HMS Gandhi, wouldn't it? Or maybe a ballistic missile submarine named USS Mother Teresa?

  3. #3

    Default

    "Whats in a name?"

    I don't know anything about the people the ship('s) are named for other then the skimming of the intro post here. But truly its just a name on the side of a military ship.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maxx View Post
    They are warships after all. It would seem a little silly to name a guided missile frigate HMS Gandhi, wouldn't it? Or maybe a ballistic missile submarine named USS Mother Teresa?
    Lol at the fought of a submarine named USS Mother Teresa. Just picturing it in my head made me laugh a lot. Haha.


    About the topic, I think the controversy might be because war heroes and terrorists are not the same thing. I know nothing about the military and political history of Singapore and Indonesia apart from the fact that Portugal, my country, got out of East Timor making it an independent country only to being invaded by Indonesia right after that, so I don't know how much of terrorists they really were or if just military making warfare.

  5. #5
    acorn

    Default



    Quote Originally Posted by Johnni View Post
    Lol at the fought of a submarine named USS Mother Teresa. Just picturing it in my head made me laugh a lot. Haha.


    About the topic, I think the controversy might be because war heroes and terrorists are not the same thing. I know nothing about the military and political history of Singapore and Indonesia apart from the fact that Portugal, my country, got out of East Timor making it an independent country only to being invaded by Indonesia right after that, so I don't know how much of terrorists they really were or if just military making warfare.
    Not true! Of all the allied WW2 commanders that are celebrated, there is one that brings out the Hitlerites in the new found friends who were once the enemy. He is reluctantly not celebrated nor is the a memorial to him, google - Bomber Harris. His alleged crime is Dresden among others, apparently we do not remember bombing civilian London nor indeed our European tour, you know - the one that started with Poland.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnni View Post
    About the topic, I think the controversy might be because war heroes and terrorists are not the same thing.
    It all comes down to who writes the history book. Clint Eastwood did an interesting treatment of this with his two versions of Iwo Jima.

  7. #7

    Default

    Machines of war are typically going to have macho names. Many of our warships during WW II were named after states. Some are named after presidents, and then some are named after war heroes such as the Nimitz. The Eisenhower, an aircraft carrier is named for one of the greatest generals of WW II as well as a president.

  8. #8

    Default

    I'm torn.

    I mean, I support honoring people who did good things for you.

    But I also think that if you can avoid being offense, well.. that's just nice too! World peace and all that smile stuff. I guess if I was in charge, I probably would avoid naming something if it's controversial though. That doesn't mean I would demand or expect other people to make that same decision though.

  9. #9

    Default



    Quote Originally Posted by archer View Post
    Indonesia, Singapore in row over name of Navy ship | The Jakarta Post

    So Republic of Singapore is protesting the name of new Indonesian warship because the two heroes that is honored because they organize a bombing in Singapore during the 60s. Yes it is recognized as an act of terrorism although the two countries were at war back then. In the end the Singaporeans catch them and execute both of them.

    So what I have in mind is that. Each country has their own heroes and enemies. And like it or not each country will embraced them. I see what Singaporeans argued that it could make family of the victims mourned about it. But this is not new. I mean RAF of United Kingdom is naming one of their squadron 617 which is famous (of infamous depending on which side you are) for blowing up dam in Germany during WWII. And they still like to celebrate it recently last year during 60th anniversary reaches it's peak. But remember 1.600 people were killed. And if I were German watching their 60th anniversary (Including a pass by in the rebuild dam) it's quite offending. And this is not new either. German Navy once have the same problem in the 70s when naming their new ship after WW2 Heroes (Albeit that the name they were choose is German WW2 commanders that is known for their act of kindness to allies like Erwin Rommel)

    So what do you think of it? I personally believe that it is freedom of a democratic country to naming their heroes. And I believe the phrase "One man's heroes is another man's enemies"


    Quote Originally Posted by Maxx View Post
    They are warships after all. It would seem a little silly to name a guided missile frigate HMS Gandhi, wouldn't it? Or maybe a ballistic missile submarine named USS Mother Teresa?


    Quote Originally Posted by Fire2box View Post
    "Whats in a name?"

    I don't know anything about the people the ship('s) are named for other then the skimming of the intro post here. But truly its just a name on the side of a military ship.
    i read the entire thread.....
    and honestly, i don't care at all about the petty politics of how other countries name their ships.

    having served with passion, honor and pride in The United States Navy Submarine Service, i know something of what it takes to get good Fighting Men to volunteer in what in the 70's, everyone else in the military was referring to as coffins and shit-tubes.... (a rose by any other name). an SSN or SSBN sub....

    it took pride in both a name, and a reputation. pride worth living in the worst conditions imaginable. and if need be, at any moment of any hour, fighting and possibly dying in the depths of the ocean without question, and without a chance of survival.....

    you ask whats in a name.
    nothing.....

    not unless that name is worn by a ship, and is synonymous with a hull-number, and carries with it the reputation of an American Man of War.....
    in such a case that Ship, or Boat (if it's a sub) is alive with fighting Spirit and the Will to Win and Survive, or go down blazing.....

    it's Men that bring a ship Alive with Spirit and Pride. and it's the Ship that lends Men the Steel needed to harden their Resolve and temper their Honor.
    the one can't live without the other. once joined, they are forever symbiont.... ask any sailor.

    names don't matter until your required to risk your life, or fight in their shadow (as it were).
    then they truly become a rally cry, a sense of pride, an icon....

    lodge wrecker

  10. #10

    Default

    A warship is created to inflict the most damage possible, in the most horrific ways, and kill as many people as it can. Let's not spoil the happy moment by giving it an offensive name.

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