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Thread: on the subject of abortion

  1. #1

    Default on the subject of abortion

    now, im for womens choice

    however theres jst one thng i cant wrap my head around

    just why does impregnation by rape mean it gets aborted almost all of the times. i mean... i just dont get why carrying that baby is an issue, and why, if you dont wanna be reminded of it your whole life, send it for adoption if necessary and forget about it then

    i dunno maybe im missing something here, but i dont know what that missing piece is.

    btw, to people thinking something along the linesg 'this guy is is fail' i woudnt be asking these qustion if i already had an idea of the answer. so please keep such sentiments to yourself and tr to contribte constructively.


    ok, ive now had that question fairly well answered by mixi nyxi. who explained not along the lines of 'because its traumatic' but gave a immensely detailed answer, more detailed than i ever dared hope to get, so thank you very much

    and the second question relates to the act itself.
    that question is based on a realisation, while the ct of rape is clearly a vey traumatic one... and yes im generally familiar with the general and legal deinition of rape

    precisely what is at least the main psycological contributer to that trauma, is it an issue of trust? or somethng else..

    and no its not self evident.
    Last edited by the0silent0alchemist; 12-Feb-2011 at 15:43.

  2. #2

    Default

    . . .
    They were raped. And chances are, they're not ready to be a mother. Nine months carrying a heavy reminder of a traumatic experience and going through all the pain just to give birth to an unwanted child? If you don't want to love and cherish the baby despite that, it's silly to bring the poor thing into the world. Who wants to find out that they were adopted and that their father was a rapist and their mother doesn't love them? I'm all for people raising the children and loving them as their son/daughter and not abusing them as rape offspring, but if you're not prepared to love the child then why go through all that pain just to bring pain to the child. Sure the child can live through that but the only arguments are the arguments for pro-life. I don't think you realise the trauma caused from being raped.

  3. #3

    Default

    thats another thing... i get its traumatic, every person whoes experiencd rape says that, but what exactly makes it traumatic, especially ifphysical violance isnt used.

    forgive mefor having the empathy of a rock

  4. #4
    Loopygone

    Default

    Wow really?

    Whats traumatic about being raped? The fact that in most cases physical violence (or at least some form of physical restraint) is used, the fact that it's taking something by force (physical or mentally) from someone who Does Not want it to happen. The act of turning something that should be loving, enjoyable, and pleasant and poisoning it for a long time afterward?

  5. #5
    Butterfly Mage

    Default

    I have a pretty direct philosophy on abortion.

    1. Are you a man? If so, STFU. The topic doesn't concern you one bit.
    2. Are you a female and are against abortion? Don't have one.

  6. #6

    Default



    Quote Originally Posted by Butterfly Mage View Post
    I have a pretty direct philosophy on abortion.

    1. Are you a man? If so, STFU. The topic doesn't concern you one bit.
    2. Are you a female and are against abortion? Don't have one.
    gee thanx
    in a sense it does, specially if your concerned about the externalities Externality - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    an exxample of an externality, falling bak on a disease like malaria, when someone is infected by malaria, they will requre X amount of care, and they themselves cannot work so someone else has to, theres greater rates of consumption of hospital resources, thus requiring faster manufacture and more funding needed etc etc
    orair pollution, a factory that covers externalities covers not just their direct costs but the costs on society, like the effects of increased incidences of lung cancer, and chronic bronchitis etc.

    yes i just turned the otherwise moral issue of birth and death into a problem of supply and economics.

    so dont say we dont have view in this, we DO ... its just not the one you thought its not really one of personal emotion or such. unless of course your the father of the 'child' i use that term loosely

    that said ill giive my opinion and that opinion, is that if a women wants they can abort, however id, if possible prefer carrying full term and set up for adoption since theres plenty who want a kid but cant due to homosexual relations, infertility, old age.

    ---------- Post added at 02:17 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:13 AM ----------



    Quote Originally Posted by Loopy View Post
    Wow really?

    Whats traumatic about being raped? The fact that in most cases physical violence (or at least some form of physical restraint) is used, the fact that it's taking something by force (physical or mentally) from someone who Does Not want it to happen. The act of turning something that should be loving, enjoyable, and pleasant and poisoning it for a long time afterward?
    did you address those to soundlike they should have been obvious reasons? if so, they wernt otherwise i wouldnt have asked.

    im also , being prompted by that, how much would that of personal trust factor in, would you say, alot? or abit?

    cuz i KNOW some arnt violant, the majority being the 'date rape' variety, i.e girl is drunk or drugged up or otherwise unconciousible and someone has sex with them , one example that comes to mind is veronica mars, in which exactly that happens (and subsequently contracts clamydia.)

  7. #7

    Default

    I was going to try and reply to this...but it would be more effective for me to smash my head into a brick wall. Repeatedly. I don't think you're understanding the depth of the emotional scarring that goes with rape, whether the woman is conscious of it or NOT.

    How about you wake up, go about your business and discover you've contracted a horrible disease like AIDS...how? You got date-raped by an infected person. You didn't know it, so you can't feel violated or want to get rid of it. That's what you've basically been saying about women who are date-raped.

  8. #8
    Butterfly Mage

    Default

    Silent Deadly: Your assertion that rape victims should be forced to carry the baby to term for the benefit of GLBTs seeking adoption is absurd. As a gay man, I can tell you firsthand that I would never want a rape victim to be forced to produce a baby against her will -- no matter how badly I wanted to adopt.

  9. #9

    Default



    Quote Originally Posted by Butterfly Mage View Post
    Silent Deadly: Your assertion that rape victims should be forced to carry the baby to term for the benefit of GLBTs seeking adoption is absurd. As a gay man, I can tell you firsthand that I would never want a rape victim to be forced to produce a baby against her will -- no matter how badly I wanted to adopt.
    Not to mention the many thousands of children already in the system who can't find loving families. The ones who grow up in foster care or are 'too old' for some people to want to adopt. There is no need to force anyone to do such a thing while there are so many who still need help.

  10. #10

    Default

    What's traumatic about carrying a baby conceived from RAPE?!?! Seriously? No, really. Seriously?!

    I just...dammit. I have to. This deserves the Picard. No wait! The Picard AND the Riker:


    I'm sorry. I'm really not trying to be mean here, but I've seen this question or a derivative of it WAY too many times, and each time I just don't understand how people fail to understand this. In my mind, it shouldn't matter whether you are a man, a woman, have ever been a victim of rape, or anything else, you just need to be an empathetic human.

    Giving the baby up for adoption does not just make everything ok. Just because you can give up responsibility for the child and maybe even never see him or her again after you give birth does NOT make everything better.

    The sheer psychological trauma a victim can undergo as a result of rape is bad enough. Being FORCED to carry the child of that disgusting and vile event magnifies that immensely. Not to mention it's an utter violation of the woman's body to force her to go through something that will so utterly wreak havoc on her body and psyche.

    Looking at it from a purely physical side, pregnancy can change a woman's body forever. It's not just extra fat that she can exercise more to get rid of. Medical problems can arise from the chemical changes brought on during pregnancy and can be permanent. She can even lose the ability to have more children in one of the worst cases. So she has to bear and birth the child of rape, possibly causing her medical problems and the inability to have children again with someone she loves when she wants to later on. Yeah, that's great. No problems there.

    But even if you ignore these worst case side effects, the toll on the woman remains colossal.

    Nine months you are forced to live a nightmare while the seed of that piece of trash that violated you is growing inside you. Seeing your body change when you didn't even want or ask for this child in any way. Enduring medical procedures. Enduring possible complications. Dealing with possible conflicting emotions of hate, anger, and revulsion, mixed in with a bit of attachment for something that is still half you and hating yourself for it. Knowing after he or she is born that you allowed his progeny on to this earth. How can you say being able to give it up afterwards makes everything ok?!

    Compelling a woman to carry a child she does not want and basically saying that she no longer has control over her own body is, in my opinion, wrong, terrible, insane, and utterly ridiculous, but forcing a woman to cary a child of RAPE is disgusting, revolting, and unconscionable. It is 100% wrong and I can not see how anyone can defend that.

    Again, it is not my intention to be mean, I am just sick of hearing people say this.

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