View Poll Results: Does the US practice generational theft?

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  • Yes

    7 53.85%
  • No

    4 30.77%
  • Maybe

    2 15.38%
  • Unsure

    0 0%
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Thread: Generational Theft ?

  1. #1
    ani

    Default Generational Theft ?

    There's been much conversation regarding the idea of generational theft lately. The spending associated with the financial collapse is nearing $10 trillion. This equates to approximately $33,000 per person in the U.S. This doesn't seem plausible. If $33K were given to each person, which includes children, most families could pay off a significant amount of their debt. We have projected Federal deficits of over $1 trillion annually for the next decade. That's another $33K, without interest considered, raising the total of debt per person to almost $70K per person.

    How do you feel about this? We often use terms for previous generations like "greatest generation" and "baby boomers" that provoke strong positive emotions. What's the definition of the greatest generation and who determined it? While making sacrifices for the country, these generations also voted in record levels of entitlements (social spending and protections) while voting to reject tax revenue to fund those obligations. So how will they be paid?

    SO - QUESTION: Do you feel that previous generations have committed generational theft? If so, in what way?



    $8 Trillion Price Tag for the Government Bailouts

  2. #2

    Default

    It is a reality. No offense to any potential baby boomers, but they are the entitlement generation they have been complaining about since genx and beyond were they. Their management has slowly eroded the earnings of middle class and below families and killed the housing market for their own gain and status over decades. They attempt to apply the same ideals applied to them in a environment more hostile than the one they were raised in, and then bemoan the failures of their children.

    I have watched the family of friends crying to them over the last 10-15 years "Why are you not making more, why don't you have a house, why are you not married" ignoring the fact that they made more after 5 years of working out of high school than their children do 6 years out of college, while costs have risen even faster. Rent for a one bedroom apartment in the city I grew up in is hundreds of dollars more than the mortgage of my parents in that same city. They bought it in 1998. To buy that house now would cost me 300,000, over six times the yearly income of most families.

    I personally do not have a problem with what I have right now, but the blame game a lot of boomers have been playing on younger generations has gotten old and is disingenuous. I still see families throwing out their 18 year olds, refusing to help them with school because "thats how they had to do it." Well guess what? We make less, work longer and pay more for all of it then you did.


    edit: Hahha wow I just realized who posted this. The cycle continues!
    Last edited by frillyfoxy; 21-Mar-2009 at 01:45.

  3. #3
    ani

    Default



    Quote Originally Posted by frillyfoxy View Post
    Hahha wow I just realized who posted this. The cycle continues!
    Ha - like my last post on that thread, we are actually in concurrence on most of what was previously discussed. So it's no surprise, to me at least, that we are in concurrence here as well. For the record, I considered the previous exchange a debate and not an argument - which is why I chose not to reply to your last post on that thread.

    Thank you for your thoughts.

  4. #4

    Default



    Quote Originally Posted by PulcherAnimus View Post
    Ha - like my last post on that thread, we are actually in concurrence on most of what was previously discussed. So it's no surprise, to me at least, that we are in concurrence here as well. For the record, I considered the previous exchange a debate and not an argument - which is why I chose not to reply to your last post on that thread.

    Thank you for your thoughts.
    For sure, I just laughed because I posted, looked for a second and went "oh man is this the same person" after I remembered the last post about baby boomers.

  5. #5

    Default



    Quote Originally Posted by frillyfoxy View Post
    To buy that house now would cost me 300,000 dollars a month, over six times the yearly income of most families.
    :bunny: So, the annual house mortgage payment would be $3,600,000? That's not my neighborhood. :bunny:

  6. #6

    Default

    The answer is a obvious yes, however no one is trying to go out of their way to say "Bwhahaha, screw you next generational kids!!"

    So really the answer to this is rather simple and always has been. STOP SPENDING SO MUCH BLOODY MONEY.

  7. #7

    Default



    Quote Originally Posted by Diapered Rabbit View Post
    :bunny: So, the annual house mortgage payment would be $3,600,000? That's not my neighborhood. :bunny:
    Woops, haha 300,000 as the cost, the house was worth a little over 80,000 when they bought it. I was pointing it out because historically houses costs around 1-1.5x the yearly average income of the area, but now in even some working class neighborhoods the home cost has shot up to be 6 times that. My rent in a city 45 miles away is almost twice their current mortgage. The thing is everyone is frantically trying to keep house prices from plummeting in a lot of areas because a whole new pile of shit is going to hit the fan in some of the bigger markets when people get stuck in 400-500,000 dollar mortgages for 250,000 dollar homes. People are already threatening to just default and deal with the consequences because a period of bad credit is better than bleeding yourself dry on something worth a fraction of what you paid for it. Defaulting is going to get way worse. This is why deflation is bad. Inflation hurts is immediately, but deflation can leave large portions of a population once stable completely indebted.



    Quote Originally Posted by Fire2box View Post
    The answer is a obvious yes, however no one is trying to go out of their way to say "Bwhahaha, screw you next generational kids!!"

    So really the answer to this is rather simple and always has been. STOP SPENDING SO MUCH BLOODY MONEY.
    It isn't just about spending. Birth rates have been stagnating for middle income families while poverty rates of families have skyrocketed. This is not unrelated. People are putting off having kids until their late thirties now just because if you are not in the top 20 percent or so of earners you need a dual income to raise a family in a lot of places, and getting their isn't done in your twenties. The people having kids cannot feasibly afford them, and in turn end up living paycheck to paycheck unable to afford daycare, and trying to get their kids enrolled in latchkey programs. It has slowly gotten to the point were a lot of people either have the option of having kids and being poor, or raising a 2 year old in their 40's which is not healthy.

    Some people like to place the blame on over extending which ignores the fact that the housing market in some areas was so overvalued and overbuilt there wasn't a "Reasonable" house to buy. I personally worked for a developer who owned 90% of the sale-able reality in this particular area. He had demo'd or remodeled every single affordable house and sold them back for two to three times their actual cost. Of course by raising all the property values the rent skyrocketed too. A lot of people being screwed by this were just working class folks trying to find a place to live, and unfortunately they listened to all the noise around them telling them to buy buy buy. There was a period where the mantra was "buy now or you wont be able to afford to later!" which is how we got into this situation. Every late night get rich scheme in the last 6 years has been about capitalizing on your mortgage and real estate.

    Americans credit habits are bad, but they are not the real overriding issue. If you get to talk to some of the people you mention their very attitude is "fuck the next generation they will figure something out, I worked for it so I deserve it." That very attitude is what everyone is getting frustrated with wall street about. When the times are good it is because they are awesome, and when the times are bad it isn't their fault, and they deserve to be wealthy still. There is a complete disconnect when it comes to their performance and earnings. They completely believe they are so important that they deserve their salaries and bonuses more than we do jobs.

    It sucks because a lot of the discontent is misdirected, but not completely misplaced.

  8. #8

  9. #9

    Default



    Quote Originally Posted by Ellipsis View Post
    Since when did baby boomers provoke positive emotions?
    When people started posting off topic. :P

  10. #10
    Butterfly Mage

    Default

    What cracks me up is that the boomers *aborted* close to 1/3 of the Gen-X generation and then somehow find it shocking that there aren't enough of us left to keep Social Security afloat via payroll deductions.

    Well, a v6 engine doesn't work so well with two spark plugs missing either.

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