Your views on Christianity?

[Samaki]

Originally Posted by Allanon

The irony being that I actually admit to name-slinging. You do understand, irony, correct? I mean so far you can't figure out what a fallacy is, or what 'everything' encompasses.

I don't think I need the mirror.



Requoting your posts would be redundant.

Oh, boohoo, you got called a name on the internet. Get over it.

Actually come to think of it...I don't recall resorting to name-calling, although I certainly wouldn't deny doing that. Mostly just implying that you are incapable of logical thinking, which isn't any more or less what you've done. Except I actually showed where you failed to make any sense.

EDIT: Come to think of it, why are you, an athiest, trying to debate theology? If you don't believe in a God, and are incapable of thinking from that standpoint, I don't see what you stand to gain from it. You certainly aren't interested in understanding anything about religions.

Allanon you are insulting D4L and me, and maybe a few other people, when you say this.

You haven't yet made a logical statement, so you CANNOT say that D4L hasn't made a logical statement, especially when his statements sound a lot more logical than yours.

There's so much logic in saying that if god knows what your going to do then your life must have been planned somehow, I'm sorry if you can't get that, but I'm sure even the pope would agree with that.

[Charlie F]

God knows what every choice we make will be... I still think we have freewill.

I think that having God know every choice we make makes freewill very pointless though.

Anyway, here's a 'paradox', since we could do with changing the subject a bit:

God is all powerful. So could God create an indestructible object, an object that he couldn't destroy?
If he's all powerful, then he should be able to create the object.
But being all powerful, an object that he couldn't destroy couldn't exist.

So if he creates the object and then can destroy it, he can't create an indestructible object and so isn't all powerful.
If he creates the object and can't destroy it, he can't destroy the object and so isn't all powerful.
Therefore, God can't do everything and so isn't all powerful.

What do people make of this paradox? I really like it, but I don't find it convincing. I won't say why at this moment.

[Allanon]

Originally Posted by Samaki

Allanon you are insulting D4L and me, and maybe a few other people, when you say this.

Maybe I should have been more clear. I wasn't intending to make a blanket statement about atheists. I know plenty of very intelligent atheists, that have a very strong understanding of many different religions. Some people are actually willing to expand their understanding of the world around them.

D4L is obviously not one of them. I've met plenty of people like him on the internet and I'm really not sure why I wasted as much time with him as I did. They'd rather sit around and hate than try to understand anything.

What I was intending to say (and yes, I realize this wasn't very clear at all when I first posted) his blatant disrespect & hatred towards religions completely destroys his ability to understand theology. I don't need to believe in Hinduism to understand the theology behind it, but I do need to respect the religion and be able to put myself in a mindset where I'm willing to accept things that are part of Hinduism. If I want to learn more about the theory of evolution, I'd better not go into it thinking it's absurd and the people who believe in it are stupid.

I have no respect for people who have none themselves.

[Jaiden]

Originally Posted by sparkmaster

Traditional morals have been based on Religion, but such morals have transcended into society.

People say that a lot but I'm more inclined to think that religion was based on traditional morals.

You can look back through history and literature from all over the world and from way before the Abrahamic religions were established and, in some cases, even before Hinduism and Buddhism (or at least from places and times not under their sphere of influence) and see the same basic morals being upheld. Some of the most ancient texts we have - the Greek epics and such - show that morality, honesty, piety, dependability, nobility and so on were valued long before they were co-opted as teachings in the Bible or anywhere else. Cooperation, municipality and concern for your family and those around you have also always been there in human history.

It may be that religion has been so established that we now think of it as the source of much of our moral code, and it obviously refined and specified it, but I don't see it as having created the fundamentals we have always held to in one way or another.

[Samaki]

Originally Posted by Allanon

Maybe I should have been more clear. I wasn't intending to make a blanket statement about atheists. I know plenty of very intelligent atheists, that have a very strong understanding of many different religions. Some people are actually willing to expand their understanding of the world around them.

D4L is obviously not one of them. I've met plenty of people like him on the internet and I'm really not sure why I wasted as much time with him as I did. They'd rather sit around and hate than try to understand anything.

What I was intending to say (and yes, I realize this wasn't very clear at all when I first posted) his blatant disrespect & hatred towards religions completely destroys his ability to understand theology. I don't need to believe in Hinduism to understand the theology behind it, but I do need to respect the religion and be able to put myself in a mindset where I'm willing to accept things that are part of Hinduism. If I want to learn more about the theory of evolution, I'd better not go into it thinking it's absurd and the people who believe in it are stupid.

I have no respect for people who have none themselves.

I wasn't talking about the athiest comment, which still wasn't kind, I'm not an athiest either. I'm pretty sure that you made fun of everyone who agrees with D4L, when really your the one in the wrong. I'm pretty sure that "our path has been determined" and "free will" pretty much are the opposite of each other, and for god to know exactly what is going to happen then our path must have been determined.

Also thanks for the rep I didn't deserve time to go ask a mod to remove it.

[Nozomi]

It's not that you don't have free will... it's just that there is no difference between having free will and being controlled by a God... A character in a story seemingly has free will... But it was a person here that wrote what the character was doing...
The only argument made after that is: Because God knows what everyone is going to do, Why does he bother letting them make what he considers mistakes? It suggests that there is no point of letting people choose to be 'evil' or not when God can determine which people will choose to follow him in the long run...

You say that the atheists can't speak because they don't believe in God... But why do you say I can't speak when I believe in everything... I believe that your faith can make what ever you want true for you... But you are riding this wavelength of reality at the moment, where plenty of faiths meet. You can follow your own path, but if you stay here with us you'll have to listen to our arguments...
I don't doubt God exists... I just find that I don't like his attitude and I know that he can't touch me if I don't let him... All I ever try to preach is that people are free to choose their identity and environment, and it's only Christianity's repressiveness that I don't like seeing people holding value for...

Reguardless... You didn't really address the statement about Hitler... You don't have to be someone to imitate them in your own way. Hitler wanted uniformity and persecuted those who didn't follow that uniformity. I'm not calling Hitler righteous... Or saying that he was doing stuff for God... I'm just saying that he shares a similiar idealism to God.
And I was just stating the irony in calling Hitler evil... I don't believe in good and evil, I just believe in the standards I set for myself. Unlike other's I don't pretend they're ultimate or superior because someone else said they were.
I don't believe God acts like a creator should so I don't like to allow him to have that title. But even if he was, even in the case of a true creator, I don't believe they have the authority to declare truth and to set solid definitions. A creator is just as created as it's creations. The ultimate being and ultimate truth is Nothing... and if you want any divine goals, it is to get over existing and go back to being nothing, but there is no reason to if you're enjoying existence...

And if you want to claim that the bible says that people live in heaven until the world ends, at which time they go to a new heaven... Give us some bible quotes that suggest that... You may be right... although, it's possible the misunderstanding could be over romanticizing being taken literally.
And can someone tell me why Satan, who is supposed to be in New Hell (or damnation, because Hell is a rip-off of Hel, which is just a boring, dead sleeping afterlife, in Norse Mythology, not damnation) is still got the power to influence humanity if it's so separated from Earth and imprisoning
And no one ever did answer the question of what Cain and plenty of other descendants married... It can't be sisters because all Adam and Eve's children are mentioned...
Maybe there was something on female children that was just omitted... I mean Mary Magdellin did play quite an important role in the Christianity that Jesus was starting... But sexist priests modified out what was said about influential women in the bible at some point in history...
There is no reason to accept that the Jesus Tombs are genuine, But there was plenty to convince you... I'd find suggesting it was a decoy tomb more believable than it just being a coincidence... Because it wasn't just similiar names... There was nicknames and changes in the way the names were written that pointed to the people in question... And the design on the front of the tomb... That was Christianity's early symbol that wasn't kept up over history, would of been a better holy symbol than some execution device.
"Mary, behold your child" makes more sense if he's telling Mary Magdellin to keep control of their child, rather than to his mother as it's interpreted... But I won't say that it's the truth that everyone has to believe...

Want to know something funny Allanon... I'm Catholic to the point of Confirmation. I had religious education in primary school, and I went to a Catholic secondary school with religious education as a whole subject...
The funny thing is that is was religious education that made me question the world and seek truth for myself. As I learned what God was, I turned away from his prejudice and hypocrisy.
God is for people who want to be repressed by someone. It's not suitable for a western society that don't even follow it properly... I mean does Christmas look very Christian to you? To me it looks like Midwinter with a cheap sticker over the title, that has been commercialised by people looking for profit... It looks ridiculous in the southern hemisphere when you're supposed to be celebrating Winter in the middle of Summer... And Easter... It isn't even a Christian word... And if you look you're just celebrating Spring with another cheap sticker saying it's Christianity related...
If anyone else find that they are questioning their faith... Go research other things... find what suits you and what feels right, you don't even need to choose another faith, just pick and choose the bits you like in other faiths.

Oh... and in reguards to the poor Scientology joke... Scientology doesn't have an afterlife... It's just like ghosts being stuck on bodies for a time...
And it's pathetic not to treat Hubbard like Mohammed and Moses... The only thing that Hubbard has going against him is that people aren't so willing to listen to someone going off about scriptures these days... Moses and Mohammed would also be a joke if they tried to start their mythology now.

[Valentine]

Which version of Christianity? Baptist, Catholic, Mormon, Jim Jones', Fred Phelps', Coptic, etc. etc. etc. All of those claim to be Christian, but they all have very different beliefs.

So which of these List of Christian denominations by number of members - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia is the version of Christianity you want a comment about?

[Nozomi]

Comment on any... realistically the differences are just people complaining that they want to do something else so they run off and make there own... It's like someone getting sad at this forum and making their own cheap little one and telling people to go there instead...