Had an interesting discussion in Bible class.

[Mako]

Originally Posted by weswissa

My discussion in Bible Study was if everyone is born with sin when babies die to they go to Hell? We decided no, they are won't. One is because they have no knowledge of anything so they can't be doing anything wrong. Two, because our God is a just and loving God who would not condemn those who don't deserve to go to Hell go to Hell. Three is because babies could be on Earth to put some joy into someone's heart and that's what God put them here to do. So they would be serving God in all that they can. Then we started to go off into clones and decided that they go to Hell because only God can create something with a soul and your soul goes to Heaven/Hell so anything else is going to Hell.

~Weswissa

Then all of those who never had the option to exposed to christianity would fall under the same umbrella as those babies. Rather through cultural restrictions, or timeline such as native americans pre-european colonization. Correct me if I'm wrong, but i'm not familiar with any verse stating exemption of knowledge, excuses one from judgment.

[weswissa]

Originally Posted by Mako

Then all of those who never had the option to exposed to christianity would fall under the same umbrella as those babies. Rather through cultural restrictions, or timeline such as native americans pre-european colonization. Correct me if I'm wrong, but i'm not familiar with any verse stating exemption of knowledge, excuses one from judgment.

Again, I believe God is just and right and loving and would not condemn anyone that cannot physically find out about God to Hell... I actually had this discussion yesterday with someone at my job... and we decided the same thing... they were never able to find God in any way so they can't be condemned to Hell...

[Lukie]

Originally Posted by Millenniumfalsehood

As a side note, I don't take the English translation literally. It's too far-removed in most cases to be useful without looking at the original Greek and Hebrew texts. If you like, I'd very much like to talk with you about this via PMs, since I believe it is important in understanding a subject to get all sides before committing to a decision or sticking to one.

No one's expecting you to commit to a decision straight-up off the bat. The idea behind conversing is to learn about other people's views as you give your own. Consider it a give'n'take mentality. Allowing someone to agree with or refute you all adds to the discussion.

I try not to make a habit of PM conversation. If you want to discuss it, then here in this thread is the best place to do so.

[the-ownage]

It's just the old testiment that some people have trouble taking a few stories literally, but those people need to realize that these stories are based on concepts, and ones that define good morals and such. That is an interesting conclusion you came to with the serpent, but there are far more that would leave you wondering about particular things if you were to read all of the old testiment.

p.s. jesus is ftw *for the win*

[weswissa]

Originally Posted by the-ownage

It's just the old testiment that some people have trouble taking a few stories literally, but those people need to realize that these stories are based on concepts, and ones that define good morals and such. That is an interesting conclusion you came to with the serpent, but there are far more that would leave you wondering about particular things if you were to read all of the old testiment.

p.s. jesus is ftw *for the win*

Also, me, being a Baptist, use the New Testament, so all the stuff in the Old Testament is no longer used... but they provide great stories for us to abide by and most of the rules set down in the OT are in the NT so it doesn't matter...

~Weswissa

[link]

i don't think that the bible should be taken literaly. it should just be a book that tells you how to be a good person.

[kite]

Originally Posted by link

i don't think that the bible should be taken literaly. it should just be a book that tells you how to be a good person.

just like lord of the rings!
also, if clones have no souls does that mean i can kill my clones at will? i believe i have a doppleganger and i'm worried that if i don't kill it it could get the idea first and then kill me out of fear.
and if it's ok to kill my clone out of fear, or some sick internal instinct, or maybe i just want to taste human flesh, whatever, do i have to do a certain ritual so i don't become tainted with clone blood?
oh and one last thing, with the US being known to use clones and modified genes in their food supply does that mean we're all full of sinful micro clone particulates thus infecting us with sin by means that which we cannot comprehend?

[Mako]

Originally Posted by weswissa

Again, I believe God is just and right and loving and would not condemn anyone that cannot physically find out about God to Hell... I actually had this discussion yesterday with someone at my job... and we decided the same thing... they were never able to find God in any way so they can't be condemned to Hell...

Last I checked the ONLY way to be saved is through christ, so correct me if i'm wrong. God always isn't what humans would conceive as "Fair". Just look at job, ****ed around for essentially a bet.

On the topic of cloning, if a clone has no soul, then it is not a sin to murder them. Thus inherently if we can clone fetuses, by the logic you presented, stem cell research is A-okay by you.

[kite]

finally i can find out what baby tastes like!

[Colonel Brome Teks]

Speaking of stem cells, I heard that some british research group was going to be combining human stemcells into animal embryos to create largeer quantities of stem cells that do not come from fetuses. So, animal human hybrids (even though according to the plans, they will never even get close to maturity).